Episode 10: Mary Pittman - An Average Athlete

Episodes

Jun 9

My friend Mary Pittman swam from Alcatraz, missed a race by a full day, and turned a joke over drinks in Tahoe into a brand for the rest of us: Average Athlete.

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About this episode

Mary Pittman is a fellow entrepreneur, a mom, a marathoner, and a public health professional whose work has taken her from Santiago, Chile to San Francisco to Uganda and Malawi. She grew up in Montclair, New Jersey, went to Miami University in Ohio like me, and now lives in Indy. She is also the founder of Average Athlete, a brand built on the idea that you can call yourself an athlete no matter where you are.

We recorded this one at the Carmel library, and it is a wandering, fun conversation. We talk about her daily runs to the Golden Gate Bridge, her swim from Alcatraz, running the San Francisco Marathon, getting escorted off the bike side of the bridge, and the Crater Lake race she and her friends showed up for a day late. Then we dig into how Average Athlete started and what she dreams of building with it.

In this episode, we discuss

Meeting through a mentor and our shared Miami University roots
Growing up in Montclair, New Jersey with New York City in her backyard
Dating her husband Cody on the Miami rec center rock wall
Moving to Santiago, Chile, teaching English, and climbing at Casa Boulder
Daily runs from Fisherman's Wharf to the Golden Gate Bridge in San Francisco
Training with an open water group and swimming about two miles from Alcatraz
Running every San Francisco Marathon distance for the 52 Mile Club
Getting escorted off the bike side of the Golden Gate Bridge mid-run
Face-planting on the Miami indoor track as a freshman
Missing the Crater Lake race by a day because it was on a Saturday
Earning a master's in public health and working on global health in Uganda and Malawi
How a joke in Tahoe about sponsoring average athletes became Average Athlete
Strangers stopping her to ask what Average Athlete means
Her dream of a race takeover and a gathering spot with a bar called The Gym
The Double Dipsea trail race and a swimrun race in Michigan on her list

Chapters

Intro
How we met and Miami University
Growing up in Montclair, New Jersey
Rock climbing and moving to Santiago, Chile
Running in San Francisco
Swimming from Alcatraz
The San Francisco Marathon
Embarrassing running stories
Missing the Crater Lake race
Public health work in Africa
Starting Average Athlete
Dreams for Average Athlete
Mantra and next finish lines

Where to find Mary

Average Athlete: teamaverageathlete.com
Instagram: @teamaverageathlete

Mentioned in this episode

Races: San Francisco Marathon, Escape from Alcatraz swim, Crater Lake, Double Dipsea, Indy Monumental Marathon
Organizations and charities: Average Athlete, Miami University, Watsi, Axiom, The North Face, Carmel Clay Public Library
Other: Shoe Dog by Phil Knight, Kara Goucher's book, Free Solo

Previous guests mentioned

Rachel Sinders (Episode 8)

Related episodes

Frequently asked

Who founded Average Athlete?

Mary Pittman founded Average Athlete, a brand that started as a joke with friends in San Francisco about sponsoring average athletes instead of pros, and grew into apparel celebrating regular people who move their bodies.

Did Mary Pittman swim from Alcatraz?

Yes. Mary Pittman trained with an open water group in the San Francisco Bay and swam a little over two miles from a boat near Alcatraz back to shore.

What is the San Francisco Marathon 52 Mile Club?

Mary Pittman explains that the San Francisco Marathon offers a first half, second half, full marathon, and 5K, and runners who complete them all join the 52 Mile Club.

Support this show

Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically, so it may contain errors.

Welcome to finish lines and Milestones with Ali, Brett knocker, incredible stories and tales of Triumph with everyday people achieving their goals and fitness. This podcast brought to you by athlete, bouquets celebrate, Finish Line's and Milestones are the people that you love by visiting athlete bouquets.com. Well, it's a big day on Finish Lines and Milestones because it is episode 10. We are in double digits people and I never would have thought that this would have flown by so fast already. So this is Ali. Brettnacher and I am your host today. I'm talking to a friend of mine, Mary Pittman, who is just lovely and she's a fellow entrepreneur, but she is currently still working a day job that takes her around the world literally She is also a mother, a runner, marathoner.

And she has so many interesting stories, only a few of which were captured here. But we talked about, we both went to Miami of Ohio. We talked about her travels in Africa. We talked about life in San Francisco and we talked about her company average athlete, which I'm a huge fan of. So you definitely need to to check them out. If there's one thing you do after this, and if you are enjoying this episode on a long run, I It's a good run for you and I hope you love this conversation with my friend, Mary. Hello. How's it going? I'm nervous but good. It's fine.

It's fine. We're just here, talking. I do with these ridiculous headsets on feels legit. It's really legit. So this is the first time in the Carmel library that we've actually used or that I've actually used the setup, they provide usually just bring my own microphones but now I have a feeling this is going to up the game, sounds good. Yeah in my ear, my doesn't meet my head as a lot of things to do before I say them out loud. Good luck sir. Everyone today. Yeah, here we go. So Mary. And I actually met through a mentor of mine Kim Saxton. I wonder if she I don't know if she listens to this.

We're going to send a thanks Kim for the introduction to Mary. She knew when she met you, she was our. How did you guys meet actually? Did you know her before a little bit? So I met Kim through my brother-in-law. Luke when we were thinking about moving here and just kind of like, oh your startup at your start up you guys. Got a connecting, learn a little bit about India. It was perfect. She thought of me and we got coffee and it was great. And speaking of Luke, I asked you again, how we how you're related to him, because I remember when I first met you, I thought, maybe you were married to Luke mmm, Clash.

I'm sure is confusing because I sweater your husband, Kody looks just like him. They do they're twins, but Luke and I went to elementary school together, which I actually don't know if he even knows that. I think he does because I'm pretty sure I've seen him around since. Did you guys used to live close to each other to maybe I Except to play soccer. Hmm, maybe around the town, India, such a small big town, which is why I love it so much. But you came back from a really big town. Yeah, I'm not from Indy. I moved, I grew up in Jersey, moved to came to Ohio for school, moved to South America, moved to San Francisco, and then came 2nd.

So it's been like, an around-the-world journey to get here. Yeah. Oh my gosh. I can't wait for you guys to hear all about Mary's World travels because I don't even Know the half of it, which is why I'm actually really excited for this because I know I'm going to learn so much more about you. That I don't even know because I've already so impressed by you. So this is going to be fun. Yeah, so you grew up in Jersey. Were you there until you went to college? Yeah, I grew up in Montclair. New Jersey. Where is that? Is that close to Yak City? Or it's a suburb of Manhattan, okay?

Like, would take, you know, buses or trains in my dad can beat it in their everyday. So not too far. Yeah. Did you go? Go, did you go to school in Manhattan? Now, I will just Montclair High so the local high school. Yeah, it was an awesome Town. It was great. So, in high school, would you go do stuff in the in Manhattan? On the weekends. I seems like such a different life than us midwesterners. Yeah, it's something Cody. My husband always like, you got to go into the City and like, I got. Yeah, we did. Like now being a parent. I can't believe my parents used to let me do that, but yeah, we would take the bus in We always go to like Chinatown to get fake bags, like that was a really cool thing.

Wow concerts and we're going to like a Kanye West concert with my friends and being like can't believe we get to do this. Yeah yeah. So it was different but really fun. Yeah. That's wild to think about. Yeah yeah because I mean growing up my childhood was different than a lot of my friends and that like we did a bunch of RV trips. And so I traveled quite a bit in the u.s., at least and got to go play. Aces, but I can't imagine growing up with New York City in your backyard. Yeah, cool. I don't think I could, I did not appreciate it at the time.

Like I remember and, you know, we lived Montclair was super Suburban. So like we had the parks and we had the places to go like bike riding and all that fun stuff, we lived in a cul-de-sac. So super neighborhoody. But I remember I would always be like I can't wait to like move away and like explore other places and now looking back, I'm like, man, that was, that was cool. I didn't appreciate. Like having and had in my backyard. Yeah, it was cool. So special. And then how did you end up at Miami of Ohio? I, I don't even know. So my brother is like a year older than me in school.

So we just did this like College Road show. We took when he was looking. I was looking probably for, like, 30 college tours and so like East Coast South Midwest. West and Miami was just kind of like on the road show my mom and I drew up through about. I think she had a friend whose daughter went there. So like we kind of knew what it was. Yeah, I knew I wanted to go someplace different from where a lot of the other, you know, friends from high school were going, just like something new be on my own. And we went to Miami like the first day of classes in August, it was gorgeous, it had the program I wanted, I I wanted to say nutrition at the time and was I just remember.

I was like, I'm going here on the tour. I was like, what do you want to look around? Is like, no, I think I'm just going to go here. Like, everyone was outside beautiful day. Yeah. It was the only school I applied to to, really? Yeah, that surprises me actually. Yeah, I was just like, I had this feeling. I was like, that's not going here. That's that. Mmm, my dad says he feels like I was lucky that I got in because I didn't try very hard in high school. You must have been more studious student. Aunt than I was. Yeah, I don't remember her like, I did it like, well, in high school not like crazy smart or anything, but, you know, worked hard got good grades.

So ever being like, yeah, I'm going here and my acceptance letter came and my brother kind of rushed over was super excited. I was like yeah, I told you guys I was going there, I'm going there. Yeah. Oh yeah, what year did you graduate? 2010 2010. Okay. Yeah, so my friend Margaret who was on episode 8 so she went to my move Ohio. So now If you count me, you're the third. Miami Alum. Yes, go red hot. Yeah, go RedHawks and that's where you met Kody to, right? We did hmm. Cody, my husband, he did. We meet? We kind of met at the rock wall at the gym.

The rec center. I forgot about the rock wall completely. I never write it. We I think I was in like the best shape of my life in college because we like dated via going to the rock wall every single day. It was kind of like oh you want to go do something Thing and it's like, well, let's go rock climb and so we rock climbed all the time. So yeah. We met there and it's wild. That is so funny. Yeah. I feel I'm trying to picture it. Like going into the rec center. Wasn't it like down? Yeah. So like you walk in. There was the snack bar area and then like you saw the big top roping wall.

Yeah, which I, we never really did that. I don't know why. I was just like, too much stuff. So we just hung out in the cave down below. We're looking good Boulder and stuff. So yeah, we spent a lot of time on the rock wall which is interesting because I picture you know, somebody liking the rock wall would have been somebody from out west where there's all these mountains and you do all the stuff. And so how did you how did that even become something that you did? I don't know. I just kind of always thought it was like cool and fun and was that your first time at Miami was the first time, rock climbing, or do you do it somewhere else?

I know my uncle would always like Like do these little local rock climbing trips, like out on actual rocks. So like I had semi done it before but I mean, I don't know. I didn't have like shoes. I didn't know the terms. I had no idea what I was doing until I got to Miami and even then, like I remember the first day on the wall with Cody he did what he was doing because good he could like do the flag thing where you like hold your body like perpendicular to the wall and I was like, oh wow and I could barely hold myself. But after three years because we met sophomore year.

So we dated all through college and after three years we were pretty good at rock climbing. That is so nuts. Okay, so I have I have climbed a rock wall. You won't appreciate this because you're not from here but there used to be a galleons which was a Midwestern Sporting Goods store. Okay. Like dicks. Yeah. And they had a rock climbing wall in the Galleon. That's cool. And so I'm Pretty sure I climbed that, but I don't know that I ever. I have no idea if I made it to the top or like what happened? Yes, that's all. I've got when it comes to to rock climbing.

So, have you since gone on really climbed real rocks with Cody? No, okay. Just stopped after that. I think like every once in a while, like so we moved to Santiago Chile together and found a really cool indoor. Rock jam is called Casa Boulder. So it was literally like someone's house turned into The living room was all rock cold and so you're a kind of like climbing through a rock. So that's kind of like always been our like we can go do that for fun but no, we never got into the like get a crash pad and robes and you know, go out. I don't know why maybe this is too much water.

I don't know. It sounds terrifying. Yeah, be watched. What is it like, free solos that the documentary on lives. Holy shit. Yeah, no, I have no desire to do that and I feel like I've started to develop like a little fear of Heights to, as I've gotten older, like you get to the top and before I'd be like I'll just jump down now. Like my legs are shaking like I do. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I have a little bit of a struggle with that too. Yeah. Yeah. How funny. And so did you move to Santiago right after college then no. So I am Cody studied Chinese in college and so he moved to China.

I moved home and I worked for the roast Pharmaceutical. Campus in New Jersey, probably one of like the coolest jobs. Again that I didn't appreciate. I worked in there like employee health and wellness center and program. So, like in charge of the gym and setting up Fitness classes, doing a running club blood, screening tests, and all that. And then Cody was coming back. I was like, well, I want a fun adventure now, and my cousin at the time, lived in Santiago and I was like, well, if I'm gonna go somewhere, would be nice to have. Family nearby and I studied Healthcare. So I'd like to have a career in healthcare and Spanish feels like a good thing to learn and that field.

So I told my parents and Cody it was like I'm I'm gonna move to Chile for a few months and just have my like own little adventure and my cousin Ian's there. In case of emergency, I just like to have family nearby. But then Cody was like, no, I'll come to. So what was To be just like me for four months. Ended up being both of us. Moving there and staying for about a year. Wow. Yeah. How did your parents feel about that? They're all for it. Yeah, I mean like living together, I picture. Like okay. Now you've got the boyfriend. Yeah, I'm going to come.

So then it's like well yeah. Okay. And we're going to live together. I think. I think it was kind of like, oh good, you guys are safe together. That's kind of fair. Yeah. So it worked out. Yeah. And I think I was like, go have an adventure. Go have fun. Like, you can do it, do it. And I, yeah, I've always been appreciative of that support. And just like, yeah, just kind of, like, push to do fun things. Did you study abroad at Miami? At all? I did I did the Luxembourg. That's from Urban or not. Yeah, cool. It was super fun. I want to go back there.

I do too, is actually a marathon in Luxembourg that I've liked. I think I follow them on Instagram and it I'm like oh, that would be super cool. Yeah, to go back and run a marathon. And through there that was a really fun summer. It's a great spot. Yeah, so cool. When did you study there? It would have been fall of my junior year. Okay, so fall of so you did like a full semester. Yeah that's all semester. It was it was amazing like centrally located at first. I thought it was a city in Germany because that's what it sounds like. Yeah. I shows how much I knew about Europe.

And if you're listening and you do not know that Luxembourg is a country. It is, it's very small, probably about the size of Indiana, I think so, between France and Germany. So, Is very Central, Miami of Ohio has it actual like sister campus there and so it made it really easy to study abroad because it was all like the same school. There was no like transfer of anything. It was just, you just go to the Luxembourg campus. So yeah, yeah, so you moved back from Chile and then, where did you live? Yeah, so when we were in Chile, I was teaching English just to kind of like fund living there.

Yeah, Cody was teaching English for a little bit of time, not his thing. But he got connected to kind of incubator for start-up July, okay? And so, at a bar met, a bunch of foreigners and he will talk to anyone, he's a social butterfly. And yeah, he just met some people who were like, Hey, we're looking for people to work at our startup and he chose one by the end that company. It was called, was it called Scholar Rue. So they were like building a website to help people connect to scholarships him and his coworker, like, Hey we're actually going to move this company to San Francisco if you want to come.

And I we had no plans, though. It was kind of like, all right, let's go to San Francisco. You ended up in San Francisco. Yeah, I moved there. I remember I actually I wasn't like super pumped about it. Looking back on it. But it was just like, I'd been away from family and friends for a year and said of, like, kind of go to the other side of the country was like, oh man, I'm going to be missing out on more. But we packed up my car first in Jersey and drove 2nd packed up his car drove across the country and just started life in San Francisco, went on the job hunt and you know I think it was like the most fun we've had their, that's so cool.

Yeah. Yeah, so we're and I'm sure if my, well, if my husband actually listen to this podcast, but where is running? When are you going to talk about running? Yeah, at some point, we got plenty of time, but did did running or like any sort of racing was that part of your growing up or part of your life up until this this point? Yeah, I'd say my family, my dad in particular is like really into sports. So Athletics was always just something that we did. Like, in high school. I remember, I did soccer probably up until like sophomore year and then realize, like, gosh, I've actually awful at soccer.

I'm only good at running and not good, but just like can do that better. Yeah, better. Yeah. And so I switched across country so that was kind of like the start of running and training and Athletics would kind of like dabble in college. Just friends were going out on runs and I would join them. Nothing. Being serious or trading wise, but I'd say it was, like, in San Francisco, where it was just kind of you had these epic places to go running. I was like, all right now it's just kind of part of my regular routine and almost like bucket list. E of I want to do this race or try this thing.

So it was kind of like, always part of my life, but not in a huge way. Yeah, I love running in San Francisco. It's Beauty like Specially just along the bay to the, I don't even remember. What is it? Golden Gate Park. Probably like I'd run from the park. Like, when I was in Israel work, I would have an Uber drop me off, and then I would run to the bridge and back. Yeah, noubar back to my hotel. Yeah, and it was just be so magical such a great way to start the day and now that Zack works for a company based out of the Bay Area when he goes, he'll, he'll run.

And I'm just jealous because I don't know when I'll be back there for any particular. I'll go. With you, I'm gonna go like Napa would be fantastic at some point. I've only been there for work so it's like, and same exact ironically. So, where else would you run out in San Francisco? What's funny? You mentioned that path because that was my daily pass. Oh, so we lived right up from Fisherman's Wharf. So, it would be like, you run down to the wharf. Make a left, go to the bridge or however far you can get. Yeah, and then back home, and it was just every day.

I think if people ask, like, what is something that you missed from San Francisco, like specifically like having either a morning or afternoon run, that was awesome. Just magical. Yeah, really was really cool. I never got to run when it was like foggy. I imagine that would be if it was really foggy. What would that be like? Hmm, could you still go? Like, you could still see ya? I think just also like, knowing the path in the way. I never felt nervous I could, I could see, like, how How if you didn't know like certain paths or directions, it would be kind of eerie but now it was it kind of was like a change of scenery something different something nice but never felt like I'm safe for anything.

It was it was it was just really cool. Yeah. And it was always like moving to. You can see the fog and just felt like you were part of like this bigger ecosystem. Yeah. I feel like it would almost feel like yeah. Just running in the clouds. Yeah. Like you get home and you were like drench to Is all the fog moisture. Yeah, it was cool. I love that cool. I miss it. Yeah. Yeah. Do you ever have you gone back since you've moved here? No, we haven't. And how long has it been now. We moved at the end of 2019. Okay, so what are we at?

Like three, three and a half years now okay. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Well the pandemic obviously, didn't that wasn't great time making. It didn't help like with. So wait, when did? Oh yeah, so you moved back right before, right? For the pandemic. Yeah. Are you so glad you were here versus there? Or I think so just a couple I mean having the space here and like I think all of our friends left either before or like shortly after the pandemic. So then it would have just been us paying a lot of money. We to be renting an apartment really small space. So I yeah, I think the timing was really good.

Yeah, this was a good place to pandemic. Yeah. I'm Remember when you and I know it was at okay, it was after that after that. Yeah obviously because athlete because yeah kind of when that started that back up to San Francisco, I wanted to hear about the swim from Alcatraz holy cow. So for anyone who doesn't know what that is. Could you just give a quick synopsis of what Alcatraz is? Yeah. So Alcatraz is, it's in the middle of the bay but it's this old penitentiary. Pretty sure I said that wrong. No you didn't Penitentiary kind of century. Think is excellent. Thank you. But it's we're like a lot of famous prisoners were and supposedly you know, some prisoners escaped but now it's like a tourist attraction so you can you can't really swims directly from Alcatraz.

Okay. Yeah it's protected the like protected land protected Wildlife. So you take a boat out to Alcatraz like right before the rocks. And jump in and jump off the boat. Jump off the boat and swim back to shore. How far is that a little over two miles? Whoa. Yeah, kind of like, well, yeah, that's really The Bucket List item. Okay. Like, okay, I'm in San Francisco. I've seen people do this. I'm going to do this. Okay. And how did you train for that? Please tell me you trained. I did. Yeah. Drown, if you didn't train for that, I feel like they were actually a lot of people on the boat who did not drink it all.

Yeah, it is very well marked and guided. Yeah, I need to get back in the boat. Yeah. Exactly. Or jet ski or yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah. It's just, I think they like block off part of the bay and there. No. Like big container ships going through or anything. But, yeah, I because we live just right up from the bay. I would go either on Saturdays or Tuesdays. There was a swimming group there, we'd swim in the bay to train every swim in the bay, which I think. The bay is an interesting spot because it's not like a pool where you can see the line, you're just kind of like swimming out into murky Waters.

You don't really know where you're going. You can't see past the hand in front of. I don't I don't love that. It was kind of it's it's a, it's a different type of swimming. Yeah. And then depending on the weather like you could have really, really big ways, everything go to breathe. You're getting water down your mouth and or you can have a really calm day or there, is it salt water? It is. Okay, that seems like a dumb question, but yeah. It's coming in from them. The OSHA act. Yeah, yeah. So that doesn't sound fun and it was and it's cold. Yeah, what time of year is that?

So what did I swim it? I think I swam it in May. Okay spring, but it's always cold in San Francisco. There's never a time where you're wearing shorts or t-shirts? It's always cold. Yeah. Okay. So yeah. Trained on Tuesday nights, Saturday, Sunday. Things with a group and that was helpful because it was a group of people who've done it before. I mean, they do it all the time. So they would say, you know, give you tips on Open Water swimming but then also like, hey, this is how you can see the currents. So if you feel like you're swimming really hard and not going anywhere, you're probably not.

So like, look for this building and head that way, and then once you see this building, look for that building and head that way. I'm staying. Yeah, so wow, it was Was, it was pretty cool and I I had a background in swimming. I just did the swim team in high school. Okay. All right. That makes having a little bit more like that sounds terrifying. Yeah, so renter I think I got like a wet suit off of Craigslist because I didn't want him. You gotta find a new one? Yeah. Yeah. Just kind of like went for it and did it jumped off the bow and it was a really cool feeling how many people probably like 30.

Okay, yeah. Not a time. But yeah, you just all of a sudden they say Okay cheering one, boat 1000 like a fairy type of a boat is a fishing boat. Okay. Yeah. That's kind of what I would picture. Yeah. Fishing boat. So you've got like, I think they're even like lines on the side of and they didn't have them in the water but yeah you're just you jump you do. They stop the boat. I mean the engines not off but like I think it's moving it. Like maybe a mile an hour. Yes. It's like really so yeah but they say like jump away from the boat.

Get away. Yeah. It's pretty like all right you get on the boat. You have your wet suit on. You're like ready to jump as soon as you're there. Yeah. And then it's like, all right. Get in. Go, go, go. I'm back really. Okay. All right, here we go. Yeah, I got to go scuba diving in Australia. That's a good spot for it. So cool. Okay, I oh man. Like what a bucket list item. We went to the Great Barrier Reef, with my dad, my sister Casey and I school he had done some. Business in Australia and had some friends there. And so we went we went actually went to Thailand in Australia and we got scuba certified for the trip.

But one of the Dives we did, we had to jump off a moving boat and they're like, swim just swim down like that. Get down. And it was low-key, like terrifying. Yeah, water can terrify his time. I mean it's it's better when you could like see ya like equipped with the dive equipment versus like the whole murky water like I've done it. Couple of like shorter triathlons and I'm not a strong swimmer. So that's also what is makes it a little nerve-racking but I remember that. So before you get on the boat they kind of like brief you a little bit and people had come in was like, day, one in San Francisco.

And the first question there was a thing like a teenager swimming it. So his mom asked the question is any like, should we be concerned about sharks at all? And I'm pretty sure the guide made this up, but give me a little bit of Tonight, he's like, no, no, no. The where you guys are swimming. It's too warm. So there's not enough air for the Sharks up there. Yeah, like no. Don't worry about it. You've got nothing to worry about. Which I'm pretty sure is not true, but I actually would have not thought about that. Yeah. But it seems very logical. It's too warm. Yeah, I know I went out and I was like, sure if it can make me feel better for fine these next, you know.

Yeah. There's actually, there's actually nothing that lives in the bay, I know. Know. It's like it's what I have to tell myself that there's nothing. No just yeah. Just yeah. You have happy thoughts. The whole two miles back be like this is fine. Everything's fine. We're going to make it it's fine, that's so cool. And then, when did you get the itch to run the marathon out there? So I think I just wanted to do like all San Francisco races, it was just like such an epic running City. So I started the marathon has like the 5K, the first half of the marathon. Second half and the full.

So if you run all of them, you get part of like this 52 Mile Club and so so wait. So they have a first half and a second half? Yeah, that's fascinating, huh? So you can sign up for either the first half of the marathon. The second half of the marathon, the full Marathon or the 5K. And so each year I say that for a different one. Okay. Yeah. And then after the first half and second half, I was like, I guess it's time to do the full and Did it. But you know what year was that here? Is that 2016, 2017? I think, yeah, Cody do any of this with you know, Cody didn't do the road runs.

Oh, come, we did a lot of trail running but he was my supporter for the full and I remember I had a co-worker who great Runner great friend. She was like, you're either gonna sign up for another one immediately after you're done or you're never going to do whatever. Yeah, and I don't know if that was the The right one to do for your first marathon. Doesn't seem like it's just really, really it's really hard. I'm so scary. And I remember like seeing Cody at Mile 20 and I'm just something about I was I actually saw he was wearing a Miami? Sure. I was like a Miami person.

Like what a sign. Let's and I was like, oh, I know that person and I just start like bawling. Oh yeah, stop us like no. But then I cross is like I'm not doing that again. Like the halves are great, but unless I was doing like New York or something, I was like, I-i'm good. Like check I heard there's a chance in there. There's a chance that there was like an Asterix like my friend Alyssa. She's like, maybe I'll do. I could totally convinced her to do another one, but she wants to do something like it would be have to be very cool, but San Francisco.

That is a hard-ass Marathon. That's not, that's not just a marathon. That is the hills in San Francisco? Yeah, I cannot, I can't really fathom that over the course of twenty six point two. So for the first half in the second half, Like those designations were there. Were there. Huge differences like was 1/2 like really a Hillier one. Yes. And the other one wasn't as bad. I, yeah, first ones Hillier that you get like the hills up to the Golden Gate that when you run the Golden Gate that's cool. That was pretty cool. And that by then you have to go like through the Presidio, which is a pretty hilly beautiful just kind of like wooded area in the city so interesting.

Yeah. And then the second half is Through Golden Gate Park and then just more like the city neighborhoods. So, if you still get some, but not like the first half with how interesting and how hard rock have you get it first early on? Yeah. Yeah. Because sometimes I feel like in the latter half I mean as weird as it sounds like your legs kind of crave some different elevation a little bit versus nice to you right off the bat the only good. I mean the good thing was like I know this course like this is my backyard. So, I felt like I could like if I needed to walk up a hill, like I know where the end of this hill is and it's not anywhere near here.

So I'm just going to walk like and that was fine. Yeah, because that's hard mentally to be like, when the hell does this stop, right? Yeah, if you can't see the top of it, I know. Whoo, but it was but I'm glad I did it. Yeah, glad I did it. Don't I have no idea what my time was. I didn't care. That's what I truly. Don't know what it was. You should look it up. I should. Yeah, it was probably over 50. Or something. But I was just like did it done? Can we look at me? I'm a marathoner. Exactly next. Yeah, exactly. So you also mentioned in some of the prep stuff to me that you have some embarrassing.

Yeah Ray stories. And when you mention the Golden Gate Bridge for the second, we already talked about it and I forgot about the story. Yeah, I got kicked off the bridge, so tell that story. So in my training and just you know, running on the Golden Gate Bridge, it's cool. It was Okay, it's part of the race. I should, I should run it, but I did not know or I guess maybe. I just blocked it out, but there is a biker side of the bridge and like a Walkers Runners side of the bridge. And the time I went, it was packed on the runners side of the bridge and it didn't register in my head.

That that's, I mean, where I needed to be and I wasn't allowed to all the runners are. Yeah. And I was like, I'm just going to go on the other side like but the Other side's faces away from the city and I was like, everyone just wants to take pictures, so it's fine. It's going to be fine. No one's on that side, because there's nothing to look at. It's just the ocean. So I'll go over there, so I'm running. And then all these bikers are just like waving at me. And I have my headphones, and I was like, sides. Great. They're like cheering me on, right?

Yeah. Got a lot of support on this side and then, police golf cart biker, come out, and they stopped me and really You're not allowed on this side of the bridge, you have to get off and I'm like, well, I'm in the middle. I don't, I don't know how you want me to get off, but the biker, like, followed me back and I think while you're running, they didn't even, they would, they offer you a ride in the golf cart? No, no, I don't think there was room for me there. It was like a one person like little cart type of thing, because it's not a huge wall.

Yeah, so a biker. Escort. A biker police escorted me off and when I was like, I'm really sorry. Rio supe, super embarrassed, but I read afterwards and heard, it's because a lot of people jump off the bridge so it's like a big warning of if there's a pedestrian that's right over there that like get them off of there. Yeah, so I did feel really bad. I'm sure I used up some City resources that I should. Well, I'm sure you're clearly not the only one obviously. Hey, I'm looking back on it. There are some pretty huge signs that say like do not run on this side of the bridge.

Present his own, I didn't see ya. These signs, that one funny thing is, I swear to God, like, I'll ask a question. I don't know. I'm trying to think of an example off the top of my head. It's like, you'll be like, Oh Hey, where's this? And then they'll show you and you're like, oh, right by the big sign. Actually, an example is at the Expo for Indie Monumental. I was volunteering at the welcome desk, which is like right to the right when you walk in and see walk in the Expo. And I cannot tell you the number one question, we would get at this desk is, where do I get my bib?

Which is kind of like, okay, like, but Are was the biggest sigh never liked on from the sea, like a bib here, or whatever. And I, so I try really hard not to sound like an asshole, right? But I kind of just point up at the sign and they'd be like, most people be like, oh yeah. We're the sign. I'm like, yeah. Where the sign says that? Well, I was thinking next year, we need to have like a big arrow that just points. Like and the welcome down really on the ground yag, who knows? But it just was really funny. That that was the number one question we got.

Anyway, I got it's hard to see science. You're In the zone or you're looking and you're looking down at all the stuff you're not looking up at the signs or it's your first Expo ever and you're just nervous. I don't know. But it was pretty funny. People were kind of embarrassed but I was like 30 Edition or the 30th person that's ask me that. So you should not feel bad about it but yeah, read the sign. Yeah, so that's funny. Okay. Give me the other embarrassing stories you've got well, the Miami one. Miami's wine. Also, I like every time I go to the track, so at Miami, there is an elevated.

Good track above the like pick-up basketball courts and it was that we're all the conditioning equipment was like, around the edges of the track. No. There weren't trying equipment there. Yeah, okay. No, because of the floor. Yeah, yeah. I was thinking of where the cardio equipment, you overlook the weight room, never mind. Yeah. So the track I was trying to I never used it. Either rock climbing wall, that was like my zone, okay? They're like different layers to the Tractor down the stairs. Okay. Okay, ever women to the like, that's funny. That's where I spent all my time. That's why we never saw each other.

Yeah, it's crazy. We walked past me probably though. Yeah. Probably like gaze down at the rock climbing wall. Like what are those people doing? That's crazy. Well, if you saw me on the track I would have was it was freshman year. I was like just like I'm gonna run on the track it's probably winter something and going to do something and it was packed like packed gym every single pickup Court was down at the bottom and I'm just cruising along headphones in which should be like my side to not run with headphones. I clearly Don't pay attention, but I just total faceplant like and it's loud.

Like everyone in the area just stopped stared at me and I'm a freshman just like already awkward nervous. Yeah. And I'm like, and I'm like broken iPad iPod headphones are shattered and yeah, just total face planted. And that's what full it was. Really Fall. Yeah, I don't think I went back for a while trying to like hear the sounds now. I just picture my five-year-old falling on my kitchen floor because that's all the sounds. You like here, all the elbows and knees, like the ground, like Screech of your sneaker know if it's just everyone. Like, I just remember everyone down. And yeah, well Court just looking up and some last.

I'm just like, looking at you, like you. Okay. I just did anyone stop and ask you, if your home another Runner, did ya stopped? And then I think I just, like, quickly escort. Of yourself and I'll be leaving now. Like I don't care. Good to be here to greet lap. I'm yeah, I was on my cool down. Yeah. Anyway, that one. And then man, I think I need to read science more, but one of the big races that we really wanted to do was Crater Lake. And is that Oregon Oregon? Yeah. So we signed up for Cody the marathon which I don't think he had trained one day so I'm me the half marathon which I also don't think I had trained a day and then our friend Ed Markey, who definitely trained is a much better.

Sounds like you would train will cause I don't know what kind of name that what nationalities that name, he's from Texas. Yeah. Ed Mark, and Mark like Ed and Mark together. Yep, that's hysterical. Actually he's the best. Okay? Yeah, I love it. And Mark, we lived with unmarked for a while, he's like one of our dearest friends. But a phenomenal Runner so they're like oh let's let's go to Crater Lake with unmarked and we'll run. So we all sign up for these races, we drive up, it's like eight hours away. So we leave after work, we get in super late on a Friday and we're at breakfast on Saturday, the hotel where all the runners, you know, they tell you to stay and ladies likes.

What are you guys here for? We're like, oh, we're here for the race and she's like the the race today like until no silly. It's tomorrow, like races are really fun day and she's Hmm. I don't know that, that's left pretty early this morning you guys just missed the race and she was right. We none of us, like really marked or read the packet. So we miss the race. Oh, Lord. So I can see how that would happen. However because we are from San Francisco. Yeah, and so all the big stuff has to happen on a Sunday. We just had Sunday in our mind. Yeah.

And like, it said, on all of our registration packets that it was Saturday and none of us. I saw a really registered that in San Francisco stuff needs to be on. So, you know, I don't know, like I could. So then we signed up again for the next year being like. All right, we need to revamp shin. And that's when all the Wildfire happens, and so that's one, like, is still on our list of. I gotta go back, we gotta do this. Gotta get there on the right day. We screw this up too many times. So yeah. Have you ever booked a flight for the wrong day?

Because I have I haven't had Mark. Definitely has Ed Mark. Actually he came to visit us in Santiago The first time I met him, actually, he came with our friend Jeff, and then I met him and he booked his ticket wrong, and he's going to hate me for saying this. But we got to sound like a whole nother, 24 hours, I think. Like, that's when we became really good friends. That's what running around the city and stuff like that. It was great. Well, I mean, to be fair at bark, I did it to I did in college when I say the rod. Yeah, we're going to Ireland.

I think for the weekend, and yeah, I got there. And she's like, your flight was yesterday. I was like, Happens. It was horrible. So I just bought a new ticket and that was painful. I called my mom sobbing and she's like, just get another ticket home. Well, it was on the way there, so ya gotta get there. Gotta get their mom. I can't miss Dublin for the weekend. I bet you didn't miss first back though. I did not. And now ever since the number of times I check the date when I booked flights. Yeah. In hopes that I'll never ever do that again. I get it.

Yeah, anyway. Yeah. Okay. So So Cody is in the tech scene in San Francisco and what are you doing? Professionally this whole time. Oh I was all over the place. So I started working I just like needed a job when I got there and a recruiter who went to Miami actually. Oh funny. Yeah I didn't know that and I think that's why she probably picked up my resume. She was like hey there's this company called Axiom they're looking for like a three-month higher. I was like literally anything to Pay me. Yeah, and that was like a legal services company. So I worked there for three years just because they were like the greatest people and I had so much fun with them but I wanted to get back to like my passion of Public Health and that world.

So I went back to school in San Francisco. I got my masters in public health and during that time, I got connected to a company called W. See ya, wa T SI okay, great nonprofit, they let me work part-time through. Cool. And then they were doing a lot of global Health work. So supporting patients in low and middle income countries paying for health care that they needed. And then eventually starting to build kind of technology to support systems and different health insurance based needs. So yeah, we kind of like spun off into something else and hung out with them as long as I could. That's so cool.

Yeah, but they let me travel around the world. World. And while I was a student and like start putting some on my studies into practice and they were great, like a kind of anything I wanted to do, is that working at that company at wat? See, was that the first time you went to Africa? It was. Yeah, they were again, just any kind of idea or opportunity. It was like we'll give it a try but like we were all young and I mean I think our CEO is in his 30s. So all of us were just kind of like, figuring it out together. But, yeah, I went to Africa the first time for just a couple days to work on a project peace.

Yeah, it was quick. And then to like actually do the project I was there about a month, I'd say. Wow, yeah, so I was living in Uganda, in a Convent with a bunch of nuns. That's fascinating. Yeah, it was pretty cool. I thought I'd be able to, like, run there being like things are Oh sweet roads and like cool, you know, geography run by some elephant. Yeah, but I just I guess I never like had the courage to do it. It just felt unsafe to. I'm sure it probably was safe. But I was just like, I don't want to risk it right. But yeah. Was there living in a Convent in Uganda for lived in a Convent in?

Uganda, I have a lot more questions about that. Yeah, I'm surely like we could do a whole podcast episode on problem Banda. And on just Forgot. All the country. How many countries in Africa? Have you been to just three? Okay, just three. Yeah, that's I've been see some airports a little bit more but like out of the airport three. Okay. Yeah, and all those work trips, rather have been for work. All work-related. Okay, you go back. Like, has Cody ever been? Will you go? Yeah. Cody actually think he lived there in. I want to say Kenya, his dad is a doctor and did some of his like red.

Didn't see work in Africa. So you guys are so cool. Is there a little? He did a few missions trips. They're like in high school. Wow. So I think we like, I would love to go back and show Cody where I was and Uganda and met the greatest people. So like make sure he gets to meet them and see the sights. And then our daughter nor, I just think it'd be awesome for her to see that too. Yeah, we'll have to find a non-work trip time, at some point or like, Go along at the end where like I write and then, you know, and then Stephen stuff after a couple days it's always so hard though because by the time that work trips over your like I was read em done tired.

Yeah. So yeah didn't need to go back and do a safari stuff like that. I mean I picture that people go to Africa for as far as for vacation is that kind of the environments that you are in like those, is that because I'm because obviously a huge continent because that exists, everywhere you've been, or are they completely? Current like the areas that you've gone to. Yeah. So my last trip I was just in Malawi a few weeks ago. I've pretty much wasn't like a conference center the whole time, but I mean the country, you can definitely do that stuff there. I was just more like Urban, it kind of felt like I was back home actually here, which is so crazy to me, actually.

Yeah, like a conference center. I actually can't even fathom that in any country in Africa, outside of South Africa. Like, I picked, you know. Yeah. South Africa seems Like okay, they have cities there but yeah, it's hard for me to picture cities. Yeah. In other areas of Africa. Just because of what I mean, I know Africa as yeah, no, it's really similar. I mean, the technology coming out of that area and just the development is impressive. Like, when I was in Uganda, which is ubering around to what? Yeah, you just call your Uber and go where you need to go. Wow. Yeah. So I remember getting on the flight being like Tara, If I'd like, what am I walking into and now it's, you know, you see, definitely roll roads and things like that, it whether houses are different and like, okay, like I am in a different country right now, but I'd say, overall though, it's that more similar than you think.

Yeah, yeah, that's so fascinating. Yeah, but I was able to do some safaris and Uganda which was cool. Just kind of last-minute, our driver between sites was like, hey, Right here, Queen Elizabeth Park like guys want to go in. I'm like yeah I do. So we were just kind of like be on our way and he just took that road over and all the elephants and all that stuff so it was cool. It was really it was really cool. Yeah, that's so cool. Yeah. Wow. Where else have you traveled just a couple other of your favorite places in the world, who because that could be a whole nother episode 2 because I think a lot, Out of places.

Yeah let's see. Santiago thing like long chunks of time was like Santiago and places like that but we honeymooned in Fiji that was spool. Pretty awesome. I think we didn't you know we're like we don't know how long we're gonna be on the west coast. Let's take advantage of this opportunity and said, we wanted to go surfing. We are not great Surfers. Like we were wildly underprepared. And the waves were great but like we were so out of shape that we were like sore for 48 hours after a day in the water, and I'm a redhead. So, I also got like massive sunburn on my legs.

Yeah, Fiji was beautiful and I think that my sister went to Fiji and New Zealand for honeymoon was like, dang, that's pretty cool. So cool. So I've heard New Zealand's. Awesome. Yeah, that's on that's on my list. Yeah, so yeah, we've been really fortunate to like See the world. I think my work in particular like being able to see different areas quite for I mean sounds weird to say but I don't have to pay for her. Right? Yeah. Do it is really special but yeah it makes the world feel a lot smaller like on a day-to-day basis. Like I'll get what's apps from people who I've connected with or work with.

And it's like oh you live in Malawi but we're just chatting, it just makes the world feel a lot smaller. Yeah. Yeah, I had the opportunity to travel internationally when I worked for exact target and it wasn't like super International. It was like Canada. Yeah. Which is still considered a national National. Yeah, doesn't feel like it because it's on the same. Well, you know, nice, big French where, you know, I went to Toronto, okay, which is even more. So like feels a lot like Chicago kind of thing, but then I worked after that or no, it was before that. I lied before that. I worked for the city of Indianapolis.

And went to Brazil handful of times. So, I got to spend some time in Brazil. I've got to run along the Copacabana, which not safe at all, but, whatever. I was just you did it good? I remember, I don't think I brought my iPod because I was just like I don't want to get robbed. Yeah. Like if you want to rob me, I have nothing. Yeah, whatever. And then then I worked at exacttarget and I got to go to Toronto and I thought, you know, man after this I just never want to have a job where I don't get the opportunity to travel internationally and then literally after that, I never ate I never traveled like, you know, I always pictured.

Oh, Zack every year for our anniversary. That's good. A different country. And like we did that on our first year anniversary and we've now been married, nine years and soul, hey time, we've gone it's hard, it's hard. I mean I just I want especially after the pandemic, I feel like people are feeling that urge to like okay I've been trapped for so long, let's get out. Let's go. So yeah. But well what we're going to do is we're going to transition now to talk about average. Plate because that is just, that's really what we connected over when Kim introduced us. And so what was the timeline of starting average athlete was that before or after an hour before?

Okay? We were still in San Francisco around. For yeah. It's been a topic of conversation for a long time. Yeah. Okay. Do you remember you saying that you would wear your hat out and see that young people? Like what is? So what is average? What's average athlete? Mary tell us. Yeah, so average athlete. It is my company, my brand, but it started honestly, as a joke with friends in San Francisco. So Cody, and I, every winter for a number of Seasons, we would go skiing with friends in Tahoe, and there was one night, our friend, Ian had invited. This guy Casey over both of them work for the North Face and we chatted just like went out to drinks but they were Calling, as Casey was talking about, like, oh I've been working with this professional athlete, and we're designing some like sweatshirt or something for runners.

And it was just telling us about the experience of designing clothes for professional runners. It was crazy. Just like the zipper handle is too heavy or things like that, so just like, I don't know, it was cool to listen to but I kind of threw out. Maybe I had too many drinks. I was also probably just trying to look for some free stuff. To be honest. I was like well instead of sponsoring pro athletes, I think you should sponsor average athletes like me and like I'll test the gear and the world is made up of more average athletes in pro athletes. So like, why not try it on us?

Designed for us. And I kind of just like, never dropped it with them or after, but I kept saying, like, I'm an average athlete, I'm an average athlete, and actually, it was when I was working at w. And we would always have like team lunches together where we grab food and just kind of like eating them at all the office and catch up and I just wouldn't drop the like average athlete thing or I was like, well, why why don't we talk more about average athletes and like, all that stuff. So if I like that team actually was like, you got to do something with this.

You won't stop talking. Just do it. Yeah, stop talking about it. So they bought me Me for my birthday like the first domain name and we're just, you know, encouraging me to like, make t-shirts and hats. So I did I was like, I made a bunch of hats for just me and friends and it's like, here's my I'm on the average athlete. Here's my average athlete black trucker hat and we wore it all over the place and I honestly every single time I would wear it or 90% of the time someone would stop us. And be like, what is that like what is average. Wait, whether it was like a good thing or a bad thing.

Yeah. They were just like, what is that? What is that mean? Yeah, so yeah, then I was like well man, people keep talking about this and let's make more, is that I made t-shirts and all my friends and family would buy it because they're like clears, Mary with this crazy guy. Yeah. Support her but then it kind of like kept growing and then I start to see like to me it was really fun to just like have conversations with people like how Rare, is it these days to like have strangers come up to each other? And like, what what is that? Or tell me about it.

And then we start talking about like our athletic Journeys whether it was running or rock climbing or swimming. So yeah, I think it has just kind of like grown into this brand of celebrating average athletes regular old people who like to go out have fun. Maybe we miss races maybe we make it you know your time. We don't know you're talking like just average athlete. Run fast or run slow, but no one can ever. Exactly. So yeah, I remember, I like my dad number one. Supporter would wear it everywhere. And I think, for a while it was like, well, as my daughter's thing, she's doing.

Yeah. And then a guy came up to him on a hiking trail like in Canada, they were hiking in Canada and was like, I love that hat. Can I borrow it? So took my Dad's hat off of his head ran to his friends and were like this, is it, this is me and my dad's like, All right, I think like, you might have, like, found something. Yeah. Which I mean, really, they're just kind of words but everyone takes in a different way. So yeah, I was but it's to me. It's all about just like enjoying the journey. Not taking things too. Seriously. And like calling yourself an athlete.

Yeah. Yeah. No matter where you are, what type of athlete you are? Like, just call yourself an athlete. Yeah, that's gets me so amped up, right? Yeah. It really does. Well, I have to admit though, I have to admit Struggle with being average because I want to be the best. So that's where but but I am like I am an average athlete. Yeah. Like because I'm clearly not a professional but I want to be like the world's best at anything I do but I'm just too damn competitive but I think it it really resonates with everything that especially what I want to do with this podcast and you and I have talked to about just like gosh, these people have such great stories and people are so amazing.

And whether they think they are not, it's like everybody is at you, move your body, you're an athlete. I don't care. I don't care if you're a professional or not. Yeah it like means it just means so much for people to be able to say. Yeah, this is I'm not taking myself too seriously. I am an athlete though, and I'm average and I'm, and I really think finally brands are starting to pay attention to that to have. You noticed that very much so especially in the influencer world, right? Because people now have these, you know, people Who aren't professionals have a bigger following than professionals and brands are like, oh shit, we should probably get them some stuff.

Yeah, well yeah, but that's what you've been saying all along. I like, you should, you know, have me do your stuff because you're not going to have 20 professionals by this. You're going to have 200 thousand average athletes by this kind of a deal. So I love what you're doing so much and I told you I would have worn my sweatshirt but I thought was going to be too hot and then you're wearing your sweatshirt and jeans which just makes you feel like I don't know. I did run this morning though and it takes me forever to cool down and so it's all the AC in here.

I get so called. Yeah, I've got this, right? That is fair, if you just never know, I never know what you're going to walk into and you don't want to be like shivering. Yeah. So how do you, what do you dream of, man? My like laundry list of ideas for average athlete. He is long, but I think, for me things, I dream of small things. One is just like being out and seeing a stranger where average athlete and like, like if I could like, just be in the back of a coffee line and someone like he or someone else, ask a stranger like what is average athlete and then like here and see that connection.

Like, I think that would make my heart burst like, like, it's connecting people. Like that's so cool. Yeah, so that's a dream of mine to like, see that we actually had a friend, or a cousin was like, Hey. So Someone's at a Dallas, Astros game and someone's wearing an average athlete hat. And I was like a stranger. That's so cool. Like those to me are like the things that I love this year. What I'd love to see I'd love to do like race takeover is so make jerseys and just have like everyone who resonates with average athlete. Like as many people as we can who are sign up for that race where it and the just see like all these average athlete Journeys and Spectators we like, what the heck?

What is this? Is this a club? Like what I want to be in that club, but to that point like I kind of wanted to like almost just like be this community thing. Yes I love the idea of it because it is it's the reason people resonate. Yeah with it is because there is that camaraderie and being average being just you know, and fun. Like I have back I have this Vision. I've talked with my husband, Kody about this. I'm like I'd love to have like a spot. Oh yeah. People to come to like a gathering. During spot. I like I Envision whether it's like running groups coming out of that like all different types of running groups.

Yeah. But then what we would really love to have is like a bar attached to it called the gym so that you can say, like, I'm going to the gym, but you're really just gonna go to normal. I would. Oh my gosh. Like, yeah. But just like a whole bunch. Yeah, meeting spot after yeah. Yeah, at the gym. Yeah. See you at the gym? Hey, you want to go to the gym tonight? Exactly. Okay, that's hilarious. I'll take that. Yeah, nobody wants to know and steal the idea but if you do but if you do invite me and that I will be there drinks. Yeah.

I love it. I love it so much. First of all, if you resonate with average athlete, go to average athlete. Doc is it team? Average athlete.com team average athlete.com and get yourself some apparel. Yes, you can find Team average athlete. Same. Same name on Instagram. Yep. And then Mary Run Mary runs that she runs the show. Gosh. Every time we get together, I get so excited, just because I feel like we have really similar, mindsets, and ideas, and passion for the space of running. And so, as I do, I think it's time to wrap up. I don't know how long we've been totally. We talked about two hours.

No, shell random journey of time. This is what happens when using technology, but hopefully the sounds a lot better. I think it will. Yeah, so the two questions at the end. So one question would be If you have a running song that you really like or a mantra that resonates with you, I don't like a specific song but genre any like lady pump up whether it's be on sale is oh like that's on my playlist. Yeah. Just like girl power, go get it, high energy. Exactly. Okay. I like that Mantra. I was thinking about this one and I don't know if this sounds lame or not but I like honestly, I Honestly, usually think, like, Nike just do it, get it done.

Just do it. Yeah. Like whether you do it the best you can or maybe it's like, I don't know. I'm exhausted, I don't feel like going for a run. It's like whatever. Just go. Just go do. Whatever you can do. Ya like that. Kind of resonates with me. I like that. Thanks Mikey. Yeah, thanks Nike. Although, now after I listened to carry goucher's book, I haven't listened to that. And now my feelings on Nike or a little different But I also watched the movie are recently, and that's so good. And I love the movie, or the movie, The Book shoe, dog, which is by Phil Knight.

And the - I think we've had, we talked about that. I think we have, okay? Yeah, but anyway, so, but the just do it thing is perfect because it is it's like just someone who cared, you could always have an excuse, you can completely convinced yourself not to do something so just just go to it. Yeah. Okay. Second one is, what is your next finish line or Milestone? Yeah, I have been talking about. Well, I think we have to like physical Finish Lines that we want to get two maybe three actually Crater Lake. I've got to go to that finish line. I would love to repeat the double dip.

See. Okay. We didn't even talk about that, which is, It's Like, I sad. What is that? It is my favorite race I've ever done. It's the only race where I've been, like, I got to do that one again. Okay, so tell us about it. It is a trail run outside of San Francisco in like the Marin County but it's on the Dipsy Trail. It's actually the oldest I'll race in the states or the world, I don't know. But it is hard singletrack up at like the elevations like, 4,000 5,000. But you're just kind of like constantly climbing up this mountain and then single track. People are blazing past you.

It is, it is so much fun to the distance on that. So the single dip see which is if you just go, the dip, sees the trail, the name of the trade it. So if you just go from the like town to the beach at 7 miles and then to double dip see would be about you know 13 I think it's 13.1. Okay. So you do ya have? Yeah that's cool. So it's the single is really hard to get into. So I think I just signed up for the double because I could get into it. Uh-huh. Um, but yeah, it was freaking hard. Put so much fun.

All right, so you do that one again. That that's like the only race that I've done. I'm like I want to Yeah, and Cody beat me in time so like I really want to go back in. We are competitive as yeah. And then Ivan talking my brother for years I'd love to combine my swimming and running and do there's a race that they have a couple around the states but it's called Odyssey racing. Okay. I think that's just the name of the company that okay, I don't know if I don't think I've heard of them but you do swimming and running, okay? But like you swim I'm with your shoes on and then you go run and then you swim again and then you run.

And whoo. Yeah, so there's one up in Michigan. Okay. In wasn't called like I forget yeah. Whatever somewhere up in Michigan. Yeah, we're like Island where they do Mcenroe's. Yes. Yeah. So you like swim run through those different Islands. Oh, so like that is my that's cool. I gotta do that. So that's that, come on. I'd love to just like, put more time into average athlete and see more people wearing it and kind of like see where that goes. Oh yeah. That's there's something. There's death. There's already something there, right? But there's just something big there. I feel I say I feel like I say that a lot always when I see was like I feel like there's something here.

Yeah. And if anyone has ideas on what else to do with it yeah I would be great. I feel I feel the same way with athlete. Yes. To because it's just like Yeah, there's something about nobody's they're making me do anything else. So yeah which is kind of nice for once. So yeah. Well, we didn't even get to talk about motherhood and Nora or any of that but that's alright. Sweet Nora. How is she gonna be? She'll be to in October. That's right. Yeah. So well, cheers, to being moms and being athletes and all their athletes like a platform to talk. I think it's great.

Yeah. Well, it maybe someday we'll be a platform that's probably generous. I got to stop doing that but I do I, you know, and I yeah, shut up. I listen to you. Well, hopefully this isn't that an hour and 30 minutes long but thank you. But thanks for listening and have a happy Friday and a wonderful weekend and happy running.

Ally Brettnacher