Episode 4: Whitney Bevins - Transfer the Pain

Episodes

Apr 28

Listener note: This episode includes discussion of depression, self-harm, and the suicides of Whitney's father and grandfather.

Whitney Bevins won her first marathon, qualified for the Olympic Trials, and has used running to carry her through depression and her father's suicide. Now she coaches others to do the same.

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About this episode

Whitney Bevins and I first crossed paths at Westfield High School and reconnected years later working together at Fleet Feet in Carmel. She won the 2012 Monumental Marathon in her first try at the distance, hit the Olympic Trials standard at Twin Cities in 2013, set her 2:40:12 PR at Chicago in 2014, and finished 30th at the brutally hot 2016 Olympic Trials in Los Angeles.

We start with her childhood running under a Marine dad, her years at Indiana University, and two years in the Peace Corps on Tarawa in Kiribati, where she stopped running and first faced real depression. Whitney talks openly about losing her father and grandfather to suicide, how running brought her back, her hamstring stem cell procedure, coaching the Westfield girls, and the dark little mantra that gives this episode its name.

In this episode, we discuss

Growing up with a Marine dad who made the kids run and do pull-ups
Finishing sixth in the state in the 3,200 and making All-State in cross country for Westfield
Running for Indiana University, injuries, and drifting away from collegiate running
Two years as a Peace Corps dietitian on Tarawa, Kiribati, without running
Depression during and after the Peace Corps and the lack of support for returning volunteers
Losing her father to suicide in 2009 and the family history no one talked about
Getting back into running to cope and to honor her dad
Winning the 2012 Monumental Marathon in her first marathon, alone for the last 10K
Qualifying for the Olympic Trials at Twin Cities and her 2:40 PR at Chicago
The 2016 Olympic Trials in Los Angeles: 80-degree heat, soapy sponges, and a 30th place finish
Hamstring tendinopathy and a bone marrow stem cell procedure in Vail
Coaching cross country and track at Westfield and facing bias from male coaches
Using running to help athletes with depression, anxiety, and eating disorders
Life with five rescue dogs and plans for a coaching business
Her mantra: transferring pain, and running the Mini for the Liam and Reese Kelly Foundation

Chapters

00:00 · Intro
03:00 · Growing up running with a Marine dad
05:30 · High school track and cross country at Westfield
07:00 · Running at Indiana University
09:30 · Two years in the Peace Corps in Kiribati
14:00 · Depression and coming home
20:00 · Losing her dad and returning to running
24:30 · Chasing the Olympic Trials standard
27:00 · Winning the 2012 Monumental Marathon
34:00 · How Olympic Trials qualifying works
38:00 · The hot 2016 Trials in Los Angeles
41:00 · Hamstring injury and stem cell procedure
44:00 · Becoming a coach at Westfield
52:00 · Five dogs at home
54:30 · Mantras and transferring pain
57:30 · What's next: the Mini and Monumental

Where to find Whitney

Instagram: @coachbevins

Mentioned in this episode

Races: CNO Indianapolis Monumental Marathon, Twin Cities Marathon, Chicago Marathon, 2016 U.S. Olympic Marathon Trials (Los Angeles), 2024 U.S. Olympic Marathon Trials (Orlando), OneAmerica 500 Festival Mini-Marathon, Carmel Half Marathon
Organizations and charities: Peace Corps, Indiana University, Westfield High School, Fleet Feet Carmel, Personal Best Training, USATF, Brooks Beasts, Liam and Reese Kelly Foundation, New Balance
Other: Kiribati, Coach Brad Hudson, Coach Steve Magness, Dr. John Stewart, Bottleworks Hotel

Previous guests mentioned

Related episodes

Frequently asked

Who won the 2012 Monumental Marathon women's race?

Whitney Bevins of Westfield, Indiana won the 2012 Indianapolis Monumental Marathon in about 2:45, and it was the first marathon she ever ran.

What is Whitney Bevins' marathon PR?

Whitney Bevins ran her marathon PR of 2:40:12 at the 2014 Chicago Marathon, after first hitting the Olympic Trials standard at the 2013 Twin Cities Marathon.

How did Whitney Bevins do at the 2016 Olympic Marathon Trials?

Whitney Bevins finished 30th in 2:43 at the 2016 U.S. Olympic Marathon Trials in Los Angeles, a race run in heat in the 80s where many runners dropped out.

What does 'transfer the pain' mean for Whitney Bevins?

For Whitney Bevins, running is a way to transfer pain from depression or personal struggles into something physical, and in hard workouts she sometimes squeezes a rock or slaps her leg to shift discomfort elsewhere.

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Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically, so it may contain errors.

Welcome to Finish Lines and Milestones with Ally Brettnacher incredible stories and tales of triumphs with everyday people achieving their goals in fitness. This podcast brought to you by Athlete Bouquets. Celebrate finish lines and milestones of the people that you love by visiting athlete bouquets.com.

Hello and welcome to episode four of Finish Lines and Milestones. This is Ally Brettnacher and we are lucky we got this episode done because Whitney and I both separately almost went to the ER the morning that we met and recorded this and, uh, her for slicing her finger while she was slicing a bagel.

And for me, I get allergy shots and I had an allergic reaction. And on my way to the Carmel Library where we were recorded, I went to CVS to get some more allergy medicine and, um, thankfully didn't have to use my EpiPen or go through all of that and made it to the library and. We had so much fun recording this Whitney and I actually, you'll hear we knew each other long ago.

Um, but since I've reconnected and I'm so happy to have her as a friend and you will love hearing about somebody who's actually a little different than the normal guest on this podcast. 'cause Whitney's actually one a marathon and she has qualified for the Olympic trials. So we dive into that and a lot of other topics, one of which is so important these days, and that's mental health.

So I hope you really love this conversation with Whitney Evans. Okay, back at the Carmel Library in an audio recording room with Coach Whitney Bevins. Hello everyone. So Whitney and I. Well, we actually met way back when in high school, believe it or not. Whitney also went to Westfield High School, go Shamrocks.

And I was in her sister Allison's grade. We were recording this on Allison's birthday. Happy birthday, Alison. Oh yeah. Happy birthday, Alison. Belated now once this comes out, but yeah. Mm-hmm. Whitney and I then re met when I started working at Fleet Feet in Carmel. And I remember the manager was telling me about this woman he had just hired and oh, she went to Westfield, you know her and, but her married last name I didn't recognize until then.

I got to work with her and I was like, holy shit, Whitney Bevins, hey. So now we're friends again and it's great. And I have since left the running store, but I knew that I had to have her on the show. Obviously Whitney is not necessarily your everyday person because she is a force in her level of talent, but she has, she inspires the hell out of me and so hopefully she will inspire the hell out of you Olympic trials qualifier.

So, we'll, we'll talk about that story. We're gonna talk about. Mental health. Her love of dogs, coaching, future of coaching, peace Corps. All the things. I'm gonna steal all your thunder. Sorry. I like it. Yeah. It's been in a, probably a non-conventional path since, since probably about the age of 22. What is conventional?

Anyway? Fuck that. I'm just dropping, I'm dropping the f bomb it the first two minutes. All right. I'm comfortable now. Okay, cool. We can just relax. It's weird looking at, we're just looking at each other. We're wearing, you know, headphones and, well, we just spent two hours together. It was not awkward at all.

And then you put headphones on it, it's a little uncomfortable and then all of a sudden you're like, oh God, it's okay. It's 10 people listening, including my mother. Sorry mom. I said the F word. She knows though. Apologize in advance. Yeah. So let's, we'll just start this, just taking it from the beginning for you.

Okay. Kind of give me the rundown of growing up, how you grew up, how you got into running, how know some of the stories already. But our listeners are anxious to get to know you, so. Lay it on us. Buckle up. Buckle up. Let's see. Well, uh, I guess really it was probably, my dad, uh, was about eight years old. He was a Marine and continued running after his service and I think just, you know, I don't know how typical it is, but we were required to do, we were required to run and do pull-ups and pushups around the house.

Yeah, yeah. We had a pull-up bar and he would ride the bike next to us or he would, you know, drive behind us. We were just, I dunno, we were required to run. And, and was that you and Allison? No, probably more just me. I don't know if anybody else had to go through that. Um, but then I, well it would've been, I don't know, sixth, sixth grade at Westfield you could do track and cross country and so I tried it and turned out I was decent at it and I, I guess found out I was also pretty competitive.

And so it seemed to, seemed to just fit. And then that was it. I continued with the school. And then again had just seemed kind of like a natural, natural ability. I like to push myself and it was a way to, I dunno. Yeah. Be competitive, probably get attention positively, you know, from, from parents, you know? I found that if I ran well, I got attention.

So it, it kind of just all, just continued naturally, I suppose. Mm-hmm. Into high school. Mm-hmm. Did you play any other sports? Uh, no. Well, not team, no. Uh, I, no, don't play well with others.

I did, no, I did dance, I did ballet and gymnastics for, I don't know, probably 10 years before, before going into running fully. So ballet. Mm-hmm. Oh yeah. Right. I can't really picture that. Do you still know your moves? Oh yeah. I mean, I'm long and lanky, so I don't know. It's like long and lanky. I dunno. It's a really weird description.

Yeah. No. Yeah. I was, I loved it. I lived, well, probably more gymnastics 'cause it was more fast paced and ballet at the time was probably a little boring. But I was probably better at it than I was gymnastics. So, but then, I dunno, you get into school and this, you couldn't do both. So yeah, it's been a big one.

Mm-hmm. For, is, is there a moment in your mind in running where you like realized you were good at it? Or was it just something you realized right away? Mm, I think probably it was either sixth or seventh grade county meet in. So yeah, middle school I was one of the top finishers in the county, you know, which again, at the, even at the time, Hilton County was still probably more competitive than a lot of areas in the state.

And I think the Carmel High school coach came up to my parents and I think kind of were like, who is your daughter? And, oh, so I think briefly there was some talk of possibly going to Carmel. 'cause Westville didn't really, you know, we were still small farm town. Mm-hmm. So I think in that, probably that meet was where I was like, realized that I was a pretty good runner.

And what, for those who aren't, I don't know, aren't familiar with track as a sport, what, which. Event is events the right? I mean, I even ran track, but I forget events in track, right? Like Yeah. The races or what, so, which, which, yeah. So I, in high school had the most success in the two mile, the 3,200. Okay, okay.

32. Um, I finished sixth. I, I think I finished sixth one year, ninth another year. And unfortunately fell one year and finished, I think 11th or 13th in the state. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So just casually. So that was kind of my meet or my event for track. And I ran cross country. I don't love cross country as much, but I was Allstate, I, uh, twice in cross country.

Is cross country always the same distance? Yeah. Well, so back when I was running it was 4K and then maybe 2006 or seven, Indiana switched over to 5K, so, okay. So every course mm-hmm. That's cross country is 5K. Yep. Okay. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I didn't know that. I never ran cross country because I hated running. Yeah.

Now, I, now, now look at me. I love it. I know it now. You love it. And now I have a running podcast. Who would've thought I love it. And you're, you're amazing at it. Okay. Okay. So, so that will lead us to college. Mm-hmm. So did you run in college? I did for a period. Uh, I was recruited, well, I ended up ultimately, uh, Indiana University was there for, well, I graduated from there, but I only ran there actually a couple years.

Uh, I had some injuries early on and I, I don't know, just didn't love running collegially. I didn't particularly get along with my coach and just, you know, at that, that was the first time in my life I think I was experiencing, you know, whatever. Just new, new classes, new friends, you know, uh, found kind of a love for outdoors and I don't know, just also, yeah, a period where I just wanted to kind of learn other things.

Mm-hmm. Had run a long time and run competitively a long time. And I think the break. It was, yeah, I was happy. I could just kind of be on my own and be able to, I think, find running eventually on my own and not just because I was on a team. Yeah. So did you run the same, the 3,200 in college? So in Yeah.

Collegially, it's a three K, 5K, and then 10 K. Okay. Um, I did the three K and like in the 1500 I did run cross country. Um, I never actually, I've, I've never done a 10 K on the track, so that's still something I kind of wanna, kind of, wanna, kind of wanna do. Yeah. Okay. Crazy lady. Mm-hmm. But yeah. Yeah, I would say I didn't have much of a college career.

Like the couple years I did run, I was injured for one. Okay. Um, so really it's, yeah. It's, it's not mentionable. When did you graduate college? Oh, 3 0 3. Okay. Mm-hmm. So then, okay, so obviously then there was quite a long break between when you graduated from IU and ultimately your, your Olympic trials qualifying marathon.

Mm-hmm. But before I skipped too much. Like, what did you do after, um, college? I mean, I, I still, I don't know, running, I just running's ingrained in me at this point, or always was. So I was still running on my own. Some, I think I ran my first half marathon in college. Again, I wasn't being coached. I just ran Ran the, just, yeah.

And just did it. Did you, like, did you do well at that? I don't even remember. Okay. I just did the mini marathon. Okay. I couldn't tell you what, what I did. You don't have a spreadsheet that says all your finish times? Nope. Nope. Because I do. Nope. Yeah, I think, I think it's normal. Um, okay, good. Yeah. No, I'm terrible at keeping track of anything, so, no, I just remember I did it.

Uh, I just remember, I knew I had to run longer than I had trained before. Yeah. And that's it. Okay. And then, no, but, and then, let's see. But then again, this kind of, I guess, leads into Peace Corps. Yeah. 'cause I didn't run really at all in the Peace Corps, so I was really the first time really fully away from any type of training since I was eight years old.

What made you decide to go into the Peace Corps? I just wanted to travel. Okay. Uh, wanted to travel. I like languages. I was really hoping to actually go to Latin American, like, become fluent in Spanish. 'cause I had, was working for the state downtown in a Hispanic health clinic. Oh, I didn't know that. Um, mm-hmm.

And so I got, I was really like getting pretty proficient in the Spanish language and wanted to use it further. Um, but then I got assigned to the South Pacific, so not exactly what it, no, not exactly. Yeah. What did they speak in the South Pacific? Uh, just, it's their native language, uh, where I was living.

Uh, the, the language is Gilbert Teas or Ebu. What? Um, okay. Yeah. So the country's bu, so they speak e kbi. So formally they were known as the Gilbert Islands. Okay. Uh, when they became independent, they went back to, I guess their name, uh, kbi. Okay. I'm trying to picture where that is. Even on a, you say South Pacific?

Just in the middle. I guess. Technically it's Central Pacific, but it's irrelevant. Uh, it's three hours. It's a three hour flight from fi. A three hour flight from Brisbane, Australia, and a fleet about a three hour flight from Auckland New Zealand. Geez. Okay. So it's like out there. Mm-hmm. Yep. Middle. Middle.

Yeah. Literally you could see the ocean like standing in one, like one side of the island. You could, you could see across to the, to the ocean. So were you, did that ever bother you? Was that ever scary? Uh, there, yeah. There were a couple times you could, if you were, so basically I slept in a hut and you could hear the, the change in tide as it was coming in and out.

And there were times if there was, um, no, because it's an atoll. The, uh, coral reef protects the island from essentially like any, wait, what was that word you just used? Aal, the, yeah. So it's an aal, I guess it's essentially a volcano formed. Okay. The island. Uh, but the coral reef protects the island. I mean, again, then it's so small, it protects any big waves.

Like the waves break on the coral reef before they can get to the island. Oh. But you could hear a change in tide, like I know a couple times there was a tsunami and I think in Tonga. Um, which is another island country ways away. But you, we would get the, the kind of the aftermath of that. So you would hear the, the change in tides and It's scary.

Yeah. Yeah. 'cause you're on an island at sea level in the middle. I mean, if one wave would literally wipe out the, the country. Okay. So that's just kind of a scary feeling. Yeah. So when you join the Peace Corps, you're assigned, so you don't really have any say over where you're assigned. You can request, uh, because I was specifically a professional or I guess a registered dietician.

Right, okay. I was entering as a health professional. Yep. Um, so the openings were a little bit more specific instead of just be going as a general health volunteer. Uh, so I did request Latin America, but was, they had a nutrition opening in the South Pacific. So I, I accepted and, and that's two years. Yep.

Mm-hmm. Two years. You live in a hut. So is there electricity there? Uh, yeah. Yeah. Some, there's some plumbing. Like plumbing. Yeah. Some. But, you know, not, there's a lot of, you know, bucket showers. Okay. You, you know, you have a bucket and a well, and, and then toilet. Is a hole or sometimes the beach. Okay.

Sometimes just wait out in the water and do your thing. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. There were just, there were places kind of just known as that's where people would use the restroom. So I'm picturing it as like the tiniest island in the future there. How many people live there? The country itself is a hundred thousand people roughly.

But that's over, that's, that's like, and again, I couldn't, this is wrong information, but that's over like 10 to 12 islands. Okay. Right. So I lived on the capital island of Tarawa. Okay. Um, and there were maybe 20,000 people on that island. Okay. So from point to point, I mean, imagine it's like a sea shaped Yeah.

Island from point to point. It was maybe five miles. Oh my gosh. So it's, yeah. Very small. That's really cool. Mm-hmm. Have you, well, I mean I guess you'd never go back 'cause there's no reason. Yeah. No, because there's not like a resort, like an all inclusive Right in middle. I mean, I have family and I still keep in touch with, I just FaceTime with family that still lives there.

And that's cool. But it's the travel, it's so expensive to go and the travel is extensive and uh, it's, yeah, just is a lot of money, so, okay. So like two years of your life where you're not running at all. Did you run on the beach a little bit? No, uh, very little. I mean, it's a, so again, it's an equatorial that's also, it's right on the equator, so it's just it.

Oh, it's hot as fuck. Yeah. That's really, um, sorry mom. Um, and yeah, so it's just mis, I mean, yeah, for interesting, any type of real running notes and, and it's just so narrow, right? There's like one road, it's, you know, basically not safe to, for one, for female either. It's not culturally appropriate Okay. To be on your own like that?

Yeah. Or just, yeah. So yeah, two years of not running. So it was the longest as I'd been away from the sport and I would say so for, you know, kind of getting into mental health stuff, that was the first time I probably experienced real depression. And again, that was. Just a learning experience. I became extremely depressed.

Uh, and that was probably like one of the first times later realizing the connection for me at least with running and your mental health nutrition and Yeah. Yeah. And kind of just, yeah, mental health. Uh, I, again, I mean, it's very isolating experience too. So, I mean, there was a lot of factors, but, and some people thrive there, there are other volunteers that loved it.

They loved the island. Life didn't mind heat, you know? But I think for me running, I just, I love running so much that it wasn't a great environment. Yeah. That would be hard. And how many other Americans were you around? Or like, um, I think, so there's kind of a group of volunteers that comes about every six months.

Okay. And there's maybe 10 to 13 in each group. Yeah, that would be tough. Uh, there's a group of education volunteers and a group of health of volunteers. Again, some people leave after the first week. You, you know, you just get there and you're like, Nope, not for me. And then, so there were people that were there a week.

There were people that left after a couple months, you know. So it varied. You weren't like, you didn't have to stay the full two years. Yeah. You know, 'cause it's, it's, it was a extreme environment to live in. But, but you didn't quit even though you became No, I'm stubborn. No, I'm really stubborn. Okay. Um, probably to, yeah, to a fault.

Uh, I'm competitive and very stubborn. And even though I was absolutely miserable, I was like, Nope. Wanna do it. So, yeah, I mean, I wish, again, if I could go back, I would've left sooner, but that's just how I operate, I suppose. Wow. Did you realize at the time that was depression? Like, did you understand? Um, I think too, I got to a point where, yeah, I realized what it was.

Yeah. I was like, this isn't good. I don't, well, I don't wanna leave my room or, you know, yeah. Whatever. I don't wanna see people, I don't wanna talk to people. I, I'm not happy, you know, I'm just, I wanna stay to myself. So not many people know this. So probably again, given my running background and love of running, uh, I actually started smoking on the island.

So again, that's probably how low I got was like, what'd you smoke? Cigarettes? Okay. Yeah. I think, oh, that's funny to picture. Yeah. Mm-hmm. It was. Do you, so do you ever do that anymore now? No. Like even if you drink, you have a cigarette? No, no, no. But I just, yeah, it was a weird thing, a weird habit again, part culturally, right?

Like a lot of people smoke in the island. But I think it was like, well, you know, fuck it, I guess. Well, when I went to Munich last December, sorry, mother, um, we just bought cigarettes and smoked like we were Europeans. Just for fun. Yeah. Because it was like everybody in Europe smokes. It's mind blowing. So I could see how, you know, island culture was kind like, okay, that's what people do here, so I'm gonna, but yeah.

That's funny. Did you feel the effects of that at all when you got back? I think so. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. I was like, oh, this, yeah. I'm clearly not a regular. Yeah. Wow. That is funny. Mm-hmm. Yep. Not many people Probably. Exclusive. Exclusive here. This is, yeah, this only heard here. Only heard here. Yes. I love that.

Yeah. So, um, okay. So two years. So that would be like 2005. Yep. So you get back, I came back in oh seven. Okay. And then what'd you do when you got back? Well, it, yeah, I, I really struggled. Um, and I learned again, so much of this. Hindsight learned that there are not uncommon, actually a lot of Peace Corps volunteers again, and I, in no way would I compare our experience to military coming back.

Only that I learned later that just a lot of volunteers struggle with, uh, reclamation to coming back home after being in a third world country. I imagine there's similar depression issues. You know, you're kind of a changed person, um, trying to fit back in this, you know, it's like everybody's life moved on.

And in a way my life kind of stayed the same in those two years. Yeah. And so, yeah, just trying to reacclimate was really difficult. Uh, some people, again, some people handled it okay. I really struggled. I had no idea what I wanted to do. I had kind of lost running, I'd lost my community there. Yeah. I would say I was lost for a long time.

I mean, I, whatever, you know, I got a job and in, I was in dialysis working as a dietician. That was all fine, but I wasn't like, I was still pretty unhappy, gosh, for a long time. So like, that was like probably the first time I really had to deal. And learn like, okay, that this is actual depression and like, I need help.

Mm-hmm. Um, I, yeah, had some experiences where I was cutting myself regularly and was like, well, this isn't normal. Um, you know, I would couldn't get outta bed. I was crying all the time and I was like, yeah, okay. Like, I need help. So that was the first time I think I recognized, like, again, it was severe enough that I finally went, you know, to a doctor to again, seek counseling, both counseling and, and me medication help.

Did the Peace Corps not have any resources for you? Like you'd think that if they would have to know that there volunteers, you know, looking back, not, not for post. Okay. Now, if you were in service, I mean there, you had medical services while you were there. Okay. Um, but when you leave, no. And again, I, again, that's, they do a lot to prepare you for your service, but again, in talking to a lot of volunteers, return, like there wasn't a lot of, again Yeah.

Like talk of what it's gonna be like when you go home at home. Yeah. You know how to, um, yeah. There was not a lot of help. Post post service. So yeah. Gosh, that's, but, and again, I, you know, some people had it all figured out, they had grad school lined up and you were probably better off for it to have that to come back to.

I just didn't know what I wanted to do, so, yeah. Um, kind of floundered a bit until I, uh, got, yeah, got some help. So, good for you for getting help. So, yeah, I mean, no, I had to, like, it was, and then kind of what, again, what ultimately led me to get back into running, uh, and helped me and I guess ironically was, so I came back in oh seven and then my dad killed himself in 2009.

Um, and so again, ultimately there's again, you're, you know, hindsight you learn about family history and like, why does nobody talk about this? You know, why have I been struggling so long only to realize that my father would struggling, you know, and just nobody wants to have that conversation. Um. But I guess luckily for me, like his passing one, like helped get me back into running.

Um, which I think ultimately was again, and I'm an advocate for medication, uh, whatever is best for anybody going through, but for me, running, I realized at that time was just something like I had to do to when to stay healthy. But I think too, to cope with, you know, his passing. Mm-hmm. Um, and really haven't, I guess, left it since.

Like it's, you know, I think for me it's, it, obviously when I started as a, as a kid, it was, it was a school activity. It was, you know, competition and then it's, you know, it's like, it's a necessity now for me. Mm-hmm. Um, like I have to run and um, or I need, you know, if I'm hurt, I have to, I know I have to do something to kind of, that's similar I guess in terms of just, that's for whatever happy chemicals for dopamine, you know, norepinephrine.

You know, for the production of those, for me anyway, like I have to run and, uh, it's just kind of now a part of me. Did your, did your, because because of the timing of this, did your dad know that you yourself mm-hmm. Were struggling in getting help? Yep. Mm-hmm. Yep. Yeah. Did you ever talk about it? We did. So I actually, yes.

So I wrote a poem after he died, like shortly after he died. And it's, the timing of it as such is, it's interesting 'cause he recognized for the first time, I think, my depression. Um, but I think he saw it as different than his, I think he saw what I was going through as like more of a, like an illness. And, but he, I think maybe generationally, generationally, he was 60, he was in Vietnam.

Uh, you know, he's a Vietnam veteran. I think he saw what he was struggling with as more just part of who he was. That's just, you know, it's just who I am. It's not something to figure out or seek help for. But I think he recognized for me was different, um, which I've always thought was strange that he couldn't see.

Yeah. Help for himself in a way. Yeah. Um, but he knew I needed it. So we did, we had several conversations and several where I got angry. I was like, I'm just like you, you know? Like, yeah. Um, how can you not see that? And, um, I, and also remember there being just a lot of kind of arguments of, so my grand, his father, my, my paternal grandfather also killed himself.

And so, you know, I was really frustrated like this, you know, it's been going on now for years and years and years and years, and nobody has these conversations. And again, I realize it's just one family side of it. Right. Like, um, so yeah, I was frustrated. I was like, nobody talks about this. Nobody has these conversations.

Mm-hmm. And I'm struggling. And why does nobody want, I don't know. I, I guess I was frustrated that nobody had recognized or specifically him that he couldn't recognize that I was struggling, given that he had struggled for such a long time. So, yeah. Ultimately, I guess in the PO the poem talks about that, like how ultimately.

I was really struggling, and as I was finally kind of the po you know, as finally as I became alive again is when he died. So he was almost like we, in a strange way, like traded places in a sense. So, wow. Yeah. But, but yeah, but it, again, it, it got me back to running, which I'm grateful for. Um, I think I devoted again in when he died.

I, it took a while. That was a nine. I mean, I didn't, I wasn't even thinking about the Olympic trials at that point, or even marathoning. Um, I just knew like I needed to do something to, uh, well, I mean, I think I partly got back into running. I didn't realize it was a healing thing for me at the time. I think I, he got me into running and I think in a way to honor him, I got back into running.

I think that made him proud. Yes. Yeah. And so I wanted to make him proud. So, and then, then it just evolved. I got back into running and started kind of doing some racing again. I was in Colorado when he passed, and then I moved back to Indiana in, well, later in 2009, uh, to help my mom. And then being back in Indiana then reconnected me to both Westfield, um, and coaching.

Yeah. Um, and then I saw some people I knew in India. I was living in Indianapolis. There was a training group and I saw a girl I knew, um, Laura Farley. Uh, she, you know, they were training for Marathon and they were going after this goal, the Olympic trials, which I didn't even know existed. And I just, I don't know.

I was like, I can do that. I, I think I can do that. And that's ultimately just, that's it. I just, just decided that's what I was gonna do. And joined a group in Indianapolis. I started out with, uh, personal best training with Matt Ebersol. Uh, he was my first, I guess, coach after, you know, running collegiately and ran my first marathon in 2012.

Monumental, uh, shout. And and what place did you get in 2012? I, I was fortunate enough and it was an earlier marathon at that time. Um, okay. No, there are no asterisks here. Sorry. Um, I was fortunate to win my first marathon and, or in 2 45. Now this was after the qualifying, so 2012 and trials that already happened.

Mm-hmm. So I had to then wait until 2016. Uh, and the qualifying window wasn't open at that time, so I had to wait until, so it was 2012. I ran Twin Cities the next year, 2013, and officially got the qualifying standard for 2016. I ran 2 41 in Twin Cities. And then, uh, in 2014 I chose to pursue another coach in Colorado and had, uh, family, friends, the Martin family, their running family in Westfield area in their.

They had family in Boulder who I lived with and trained with a group out there. My coach was Brad Hudson, uh, in Boulder. And, uh, in 2014 then I ran Chicago, uh, where my PR still stands, which is crazy. It's like almost 10 years ago. Um, which is 20, 40 and 12 seconds. So I never went below that 1240 barrier or the two 40, uh, two 40 barrier.

So that's still a goal. That's still a goal. Um, as a master's runner now, um, hell yeah. I'd love to hear that. So I, I'd like to, I dunno if my body will, I dunno if my body can do it in terms of not, not that I wouldn't put the work in, I just don't, I'll be 42 in June and I, again, I know there are women my age that have done that.

I just, for my, like, just my health, I don't, I'm not sure. Yeah, I'd like to try it. So we'll see then. Yeah, so I did Chicago, set my PR in 2014 and then I guess, yeah, didn't race until the trials in 2016, which had been February of 2016. And that was in la? Mm-hmm. Yep. La um. Okay. But I want to, I wanna go back to 2012 when you, yeah.

So it was your first marathon that you'd ever run. Mm-hmm. You trained with PBT and Indie. Mm-hmm. On the day of the race, did you know that you were in contention to win? Like, did you understand what time was needed to win? You just didn't even think about it. You're just like, no. Yeah. Were you an elite idea?

Were you an elite? What's that? Were you an elite? Like did you line up? Yeah. Yeah, I did. I mean, I started with, I guess the elite. I did have a, a help with Pacer, uh, John Stewart, Dr. John Stewart, who in Carmel. Okay. And he was training competitively at the time, and he was a big training partner of mine and he paced me through 20.

Okay. Um, I think we had an idea of what I could probably run based off previous, like half marathon, 10 k Yep. Workouts. I'd have to, I don't even know my splits at this time. But yeah, I think we had an idea. I think it was, looking back, I think it was definitely conservative. Um, 'cause I was nervous about, you know, blowing up or, yeah.

So we were just, I think we were pretty cautious through three 20. And were you, what was it like, were you alone? Yeah, a lot of it. Yeah. I mean, so is, I mean, you know, you, you've, you know, don't even look at me and act like I would know what that feels like. No. Know what I'm saying? But like, you know, you know the course, you know, you know.

No. Yes, absolutely. Yeah. So I, what I still joke with Dr. Stewart about today is he actually left me at mile 20, which is when there's like nobody around on the course. Yeah. You're literally alone. I was like, thanks bud. Cool. Um, yeah, so here I'm the last, you know, 10 K of the race solo and you know, and that's obviously like for a lot of people, that's like the hardest part of the game.

Yeah. And just, it's your first one. You have no idea what to expect in any way. Right? Yeah. Like, what are you gonna feel, like, what's, what, what are you supposed to do with nutrition? You know, it's all a gamble, kind of that first one. And I was just, I'm very lucky to get through it. Um, did you keep looking over your shoulder or were you just like, no, I mean, I knew, I knew at that point that I was lucky.

Again, it wasn't like a race. There was nobody, there were no other females around. Um, so it, it was nice. That I didn't have to, I think Kill yourself. Yeah. I mean, like, you like stressed about Oh, somebody coming up. Yeah. I could just kind of focus on myself. Just finish. Just finish. Yeah. And just get finish.

So I was lucky in that sense that I was, I knew I was in the lead and I was probably gonna win unless something really happened. Crazy happened. What a weird feeling, because I feel like most of people, at least I would imagine most people that are listening to this mm-hmm. Aren't winning marathons.

That's kind of the point of this, is that people are just normal and they're doing crazy things. You're like, not necessarily normal, but you're just, I make an exception for you. Um, what was it like turning the corner and seeing the finish line and like the tape? Do you remember who was holding the tape?

Do you remember? Yeah, actually. Yeah. So a friend of mine, uh, actually he and I, uh, for years, he, so he and I actually were teammates at iu, uh, John Little is his name. Okay. And he was working with Monumental at the time. He may have been the elite coordinator then. Okay. Um, but he had the tape, 'cause there's a picture actually of him like.

Catching me kind of at the end, because as you, you know, you don't, you, you don't realize until you run one that once you cross the line, like your body's like, we're done. You know? Yeah. It gets you, your brain I think gets you to that line and then, you know, the body just, yeah. Um, I, the one thing I did not expect was just how emotional it was gonna be.

Yeah. Like, I just, that I just, you know, it overcame me and not, it wasn't about winning or the time it was your first marathon. Yeah. And I think so many people experience that. Yeah, totally. Regardless of your time or place, it's like, it's such, I didn't realize until I'd done it, like just the accomplishment of, of doing air completing it.

Um, yeah. So I just remember just being in tears and that's, that can surprise me. I was like, oh geez, where'd that come from? Wow. Yeah. But you put, as you know, you put so much time and energy into the training, just into the process. Like, you know, it's a part-time job and it's, you know, and again, just the fatigue and the exhaustion that you put yourself through.

Um. Just that, you know, through 26 miles, I would be, I always thought it'd be interesting to like, have like a, a feed of what the brain is. Oh, Jesus Christ. That would be interesting. Yeah. What the brain is saying during people, people would not wanna, it would just be, I don't know. Yeah. Like, just, yeah, fucking keep running.

You fucking idiot. Yeah. There's all kinds of things that go through I don't, lot of efforts and, but yeah. Yeah. It's just, you know, you know, you put the time and energy in it, it's just, it's really emotional once that's done. Um, yeah. So, yeah, no, it was, it was cool. Again, I was very fortunate. Uh, it was neat, you know, I had a lot of family there to see it.

I was in my, I have an older brother and I think it was like maybe the second time he's ever seen me run. So it, that was, that's cool. That was special. Um, for them too. They're probably like, if you didn't really think about winning. Mm-hmm. You know, it's not like you went and told 'em before like, Hey, yeah, I'm gonna try to win this.

Yeah. So like, be there. It was like they were probably like, holy shit. Yeah. No, it definitely was not the goal. I mean, again, it, that was I icing on the cake for sure. Yeah. And I'm competitive. Right, right. Of course. Like, had there been. Somebody like to chase or to I, you know, would've done my guess to, to win.

Yeah. Or to beat them. But it was a cool experience. I'm very lucky to have it. Um, so cool. So yeah, it was neat. It was a, and, and then at that, I think at that time I had realized, 'cause again, at that point I did some half marathons and I think I realized like, this is my distance or, you know, I clearly love and I'm probably better suited for these longer events.

Mm-hmm. So, uh, yeah, just kind of felt like I found, found my home in, in that distance and yeah. Do you still feel, because last time I talked to you about this mm-hmm. Probably not the best place to talk about it. It was at the end of a half it where you ran a half marathon and you're like, I don't know if I ever wanna do this again, which is normal.

And then five minutes later you're probably Yeah. Registering for, so I had the same feeling. So I ran Carmel half marathon a few weeks ago and finish in 1 28. And which I, I was, you know, I was just happy, like at this point, you know, I'm always happy just to, to do it and to be out there. And, um, but I do remember when I finished the half, a few weeks ago, I, so in my, in my PR marathon, I came through the half marathon, a one 18 and trying to wrap my mind around that was crazy.

I was like, I just roomed 1 28 for a half and I came through in one 18 to, you know, and I was like, I don't, I just couldn't fathom how Right my body done that, did that, and, or, or even just, I, I had forgotten just the amount of time and energy that went into that. I mean, it was Yeah. Another life ago, but pretty.

Yeah. Well, it's a pretty strange feeling. Yeah. Well it's hard 'cause there are just so many seasons of life where you're either Yeah, you're crushing it and running mm-hmm. And something else is right. I don't know, I just feel like the seasons are hard. Yeah, you can, I mean, I, I, again, I've always, I think, been envious of like, like a Desi, right?

Yeah. Like, that's her, that's her life. And that's, you know. Again, not that she's not had struggles or, but like there's part of me that wishes that could have been like, just that's what I do or did, you know? Mm-hmm. Um, but I don't know. I'm a bit of a gypsy and I like to explore. I like to see new things.

Yeah. I like to try new things, so I just don't think it would ever fit me to just do the one thing all the time. Yeah. But certainly makes it more difficult to get back into it after being away for so long. But again, I, again, I'm very fortunate that in, so after the trials, I got hurt and had to have a procedure done in 2017 on my hamstring.

Oh, shit. I didn't realize that. Mm-hmm. So that's why. So the trials, so explain to like the average person how that works, because I've just now started learning about it only because I'm now like working with monumental, like more in the industry and paying attention, but like for people who don't understand, like how does that work?

And then so what, after you qualify mm-hmm. You were at, were you injured before or after the trials? No, I mean, I had or struggled. So yeah, to qualify you have to run. Um, so there's a standard that, um, U-S-A-T-F puts out each, uh, window before the, the trial period. Um, and it changes. So when I qualified for 16, the women's standard B standard was 2 45.

Okay. What is it now? It is, so they just lowered it for these upcoming Olympic trials in 2024. In Orlando it is 2 37. Okay. So, um, there's one standard now for the marathon. Now you can qualify by running a half as well. That's both men and women. Okay. Uh, there's a half standard and a full. Got it. Um, I think the women said this may be maybe one 13 sub one 13.

Okay. Uh, which is no. Like I would rather do a 50 or a hundred K than I think attempt to run that fast. In the half. So there's a standard, anybody makes a standard, you know, gets to run in the trials. The tricky part is you might run it three years prior to the actual race. That is interesting. Mm-hmm. So the window is open for about three years.

Uhhuh. Okay. So it's typically the, the standard. Now this is a little different. This is, I think with COVID and everything with the Olympics being changed. Oh yeah. It got all kind of, the window was ultimately two years this time. Okay. Before, and then Orlando got the bid as the host city. Um, I think there was two years prior, before when that was released.

And what's, uh, where was the tri, where were the trials for when you ran? So at Los Angeles. Los Angeles. So it aligned. Okay. So you didn't do the LA marathon? No. Correct. Okay. So that's what confused me. Yeah. So you, where did you qualify? So I qualified in chi, well I guess technically twice I ran. Oh, right.

Qualified in Twin Cities and then in Chicago. Then in Chicago, yeah. Okay, got it. Um, and then you had to maintain that level of fitness? No, not necessarily. No. There, 'cause there are people that show up to the trials. That maybe again, some women at that point, you know, are, are pregnant or had just had a baby and, but they can still run.

They're still had to run. And, uh, again, same with men. If they had hit the standard three years ago, they could, there was like, actually, so there was an article on a guy in LA he didn't run in like three years. He hit the standard and just wanted to be it. So there, you know, so he was loud, he did it and I don't even remember what he finished, but it was not fast.

So, so at the trials, is it like, is it the same? Is it around a it's not around a track. It's not a marathon. So they have a course, is it similar to like the LA marathon course? Completely. Most the trials courses are on a loop. It's not uncommon that it's about a 10 K loop. Got it. Okay. Um, one for spectator purposes, two for just support of the athletes on the course.

Yeah. Makes sense. Yeah, it's generally about a 10 K loop. And they do try to mimic, my understanding is wherever the Olympics is going to be, they may try to mimic the Olympic conditions marathon. Yeah. Conditions and course makes sense in that. Huh? In that Interesting. In the trials course. And so when you run at the trials mm-hmm.

And then is it the top three? Yep. Get to go? Mm-hmm. Yep. Top three get to, yep. Mm-hmm. Top three qualify. Um, again, for most people there, it's for most people, again, someone like me just qualifying, being, being there, being there was the experience was the right. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, yeah. Um, it's a non-professional.

Were you ever sponsored a sponsored athlete? Um, I was pon like in, so like, I guess a lot of the, uh, brands have like a, like a B team or, you know, so yeah, I was with SNE Hurricanes. Okay. And then I was with Brooks Beasts. That's right. Um, not beast now. I just think of that so differently having worked in a running store.

Yeah. So there's, yeah. Again, I, I don't, I've been out it a while. Don't know if that's, those still exist still. Yeah. But yeah, we got uniforms, we got stipend for clothing, shoes. Cool. Um, so there was some support there. Um, we weren't getting, and there was some, um, some help with travel. Gotcha. Um, but yeah, so yeah, I mean, to an extent I had some help, which was really nice.

And so, so you said you were talking, started to talk about your procedure with the hamstring. Mm-hmm. I didn't know that. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So I was fortunate. I got through a, a Los Angeles trials. I, I, in my, I think was just lucky. I think my, my body got me through that race. How many people were there? They were close to, I wanna say 400.

Um, oh my gosh. Okay. Yeah, it was again, I think part of the reason again, they have changed or dropped the standard was to just to kind of Yeah. Bring it to a little bit smaller a field. Yeah. Um, but it was very hot. So it was unfortunate that most marathons start in the morning. Well, they thought it was a great idea in LA to start our, I I think we started at like 10 or 11.

That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Yeah. For television purposes. 'cause, you know, because everyone watches that. Right. No offense. So many people have tuned in. Yeah. Um, so it was hot. I mean, it was hot and I just remember, and I was fortunate that I had trained, I switched coaches and this was not the reason I did it.

I just, you know, uh, just things changed. And I ended up, uh, training with Steve Magnus down in Texas. Um, and again, I hate the heat, but I was in Texas and I was, again, there was no plan to be like, oh, I'm gonna train in hot weather. 'cause like it just, I, that's just what I did and it. Turned out to be probably one of the best things that, uh, ever happened.

Um, 'cause there it pe so many people dropped out of that race. Oh, I can only imagine. Um, because I, I don't remember. It was definitely in the eighties for a good part of the race. Um, there was no cloud cover and we were just like, you know, on black asphalt for a lot of the race. Um, and that's, that's just so us a at TF didn't have water.

You'll love this. Um, it was so poorly done. Um, that in, I guess what, in 2020 when, um, Atlanta hosted, like Atlanta with the ops, they like knew that they had to do a better job. And it was phenomenal. It well executed. They had sponges, so they didn't, it was so bad that somebody had bought sponges with soap in them because they.

We're in there passing those out because they thought they were just sponges with water. Wait, you can buy sponges that already have soap, apparently. Wow, that's brilliant. Yeah, but not for a runner. No, not when you're, you know, 16 miles in and it's 80 plus degrees and you just want that all over you and then you have soap in your fucking eyes.

Yeah, it was terrible. Great. So again, people were just dropping. I remember just, it was surreal to be running and just, I mean, I remember seeing like elites, like Top Runners at the time, just walking on the side of the street. It was, you know, like, I'm like, what? Like what is happening? I'm still running and I, I couldn't give you any names, but you know, it wheels clearly, yeah.

Faster than me. Were just walking. Well, yeah. I can't even, my body does not do well in the heat. No, I can't imagine that. Um, again, I think one of the only things saved me was training in Texas for a long period of time. So yeah, I was fortunate. I finished 30th there. Holy shit. That's great. Yeah, no, I was excited.

Like, again, that was like, I ran 2 43, which again, I was pleased with, given the conditions. Yeah. Um, it's frustrating as you know, you, like, you, you want the time. Yeah, of course. Right. You could say, what if, like, you could ver you could do like a heat conversion and I think it was like sub two 40, but Right.

It doesn't count. Of course, but it doesn't matter. So that's, that was frustrating. But again, I felt lucky that I still had a really good race on the day in, in the conditions that were, yeah. Wow. Okay. So then you had your hamstring thing. Yep. I didn't run for, yeah, I, again, at that point, my body, I think just kinda shut down was done.

Yeah. And what was that? So you had to have a, did your hamstring like tear or what kind of Yeah, I had small tear. It's called, I guess height, hamstring, tendinopathy. Whoa. I went to chiropractor, acupuncture, dry needling, just I, everything. And then finally connected with a group out in Colorado, in Vail.

Okay. And they specialize in doing, uh, they work with a lot of skiers, um, and they do procedures now. So PRP is more common. It's a little less invasive. Okay. Um, and it's becoming now more popular all over. So you can do PRP, I think here in Indianapolis. What's that mean? I, not entirely sure, but I know they, so the process, I essentially, I'm completely simplifying this, but they draw your blood Okay.

And use, and they process somehow, and then they use your own blood. They reinject it into the injury site. Oh yeah, I've heard, I've heard of that. To help, um, I guess kind of create healing. Mm-hmm. So I was in Vail, and so a little more invasive procedure is stem cell. Um, and they're like, you know, you're here.

This is like PRP maybe takes a few times. And again, they were like, you flew out here. Are you okay to do stem cell? I was like, yeah, sure. Why not? I have no idea what you did. Whatever you got. Yeah. Well, so stem cell, I, again, I know now, uh, probably had, I thought through it again. I was by myself, um, out in Vail.

Yeah. And was planning to catch a flight the next day and turns out, so what stem cell is, um, essentially they strapped me down to the table. Um, f you know, I was on my stomach, uh, and I, again, I had no, I just, I'm an idiot. I don't ask questions like, yeah, that sounds great. Oh, let's do it. Just, yeah. No research.

Sure. Uh, yeah. So they drill, they use a drill and they went into two space, uh, spots in my pelvic, my pelvis in the back, um, and in withdrew bone marrow. Um, and then process the bone marrow, and then they use this incredibly like long needle. And then they inject that into, like, they go all the way into like, deep into the hamstring tendon.

Okay. That's all we need to know about that. Yeah. Whitney. Mm-hmm. What the hell? Yeah. What? Yeah. Were you, you weren't asleep? No, no. I was awake. And they can only, what? Yeah. It's crazy. So anyway. Did it work? It did. Okay. Thank God it did. Yeah. No, yeah. Luckily, geez. Because I would not go, I don't think I'll ever go through that again.

Well, that sounds like, yeah, that sounds mm-hmm. Really horrible. Yeah. It was fun. So, yeah. But anyway, I didn't run for. A long time after that. Yeah. And well, yeah, I couldn't run for a full year, so this was 2017 when I had the procedure. Okay. Um, and, and then, you know, of course then in post procedure that takes time and then you gotta build your fitness.

Yeah. So at that point I'd just been away from it for a long time and really struggled again. I had left, my training group was back in Indianapolis and I think it was a struggling to, I don't know, I didn't know what I wanna do with running at that point anymore. Mm-hmm. 'cause you know, in, when I was in Colorado, I just had a bunch of people to run with all the time and it was easy to get out the door.

And I think probably again similarly, but not as bad. I was probably struggling with some depression after the procedure, not again, not being able to run for long time. Yeah. Um, and so I was fortunate in 2019, I got a call from my former high school coach and he just asked, he said, we need a chaperone at our camp.

Are you by chance available? We need a female chap. And I was like, yeah, I, yeah, I can do that. I was working at a school at the time, so my schedule finally aligned professionally, I guess, to help be able to help coaching. And after camp, he's just asked if I want to continue working with the team and yeah.

Well, yeah, that sounds great. And so I became an assistant at Westfield for two years, and then, uh, when he stepped down, he handed the program over to me. And so kind of, that was, I guess, kinda my next, I guess next chapter. Mm-hmm. In, in running, uh, was becoming a coach was incredible experience. Um, how did you, did you, how did you learn how to be a coach?

I feel like, I don't know, we talk a lot about just as a society Yeah. With like imposter syndrome, right? Like, clearly for somebody like you who has been, I mean, you already were a great athlete when you were in, in school, and then obviously won a marathon, you know, qualified for the Olympic trials. Mm-hmm.

So clearly you've got some experience, but that's not the same as like, no. Coaching. So could you talk about like, how did you mimic some of what your coach did? Well, yeah. Did you, how did you kind of, um, do that? Yeah, I mean, I was, again, I was fortunate he was a good mentor. Um, and he, again, he was my high school coach too.

Mm-hmm. Um, I think that was probably the, probably the hardest part for me was being an elite athlete, because I really struggled relating sometimes to some of the girls and they're, you know, I'm just, I'm so competitive as competi. Yeah. If they're not as competitive, you're like, right. I, like, I, yeah. So I, that took me time to learn and to get better at, 'cause I'm like, just go run.

You just go run hard. Like, it's not, it's not the hard that, that was. Well, it's a work in progress, right? Like, I don't know that I ever mastered it, but I definitely got better and that was a piece where I had to step away from. I, I think there were so many assumptions in my mind. I just, for so long did things just, I just did it right.

Yeah. You just, I knew how to put my body through discomfort. I knew how to push myself. Um, I just, there were so many things I just did automatically that I didn't know I had to. Saving get people to do or, yeah. Yeah. Or even, yeah, communicate it. So I think, again, I brought a lot of experience. I had a lot of experience that was valuable.

I had to learn to, I think, how to share it and communicate it. Mm-hmm. Um, and speaking of imposter syndrome, like in a predominantly male, what's the word I'm looking for? Industry. Thank you. Yeah. You know, high school athletics still are, and running is no different. They're where I was excited. I thought, here I am.

Like, I mean, this is finally a place I belong. I was met with more, what's the word? Not what is this like bias or not? Um, um, no insecurity. Again, I was excited like, I have all this value or this, you know, I. You know, I have a lot of back, I'm a dietician, right? Yeah. You're like, this is my jam. Yeah. Like I'm, you know, I in belong here.

I've really found a lot of male coaches were actually insecure. They were intimidated. I guess I, by my experience, um, by the ability, the fact that I could even run with athletes still, and, you know, were, so, I was excited. I was completely naive to that, uh, fact that a lot of male coaches were, were not gonna be nearly as excited as I thought they were, that I was on staff and was just met with a lot of, um, it was just not what I had hoped for.

Yeah. I think they were just, I could be at a table with a bunch of male coaches and they would talk amongst themselves and they would never ask me a question, uh, like, what do you think about this? What would you do? And I don't even know if they were aware of it. Yeah. Not that they were even doing it. So I was just, that was not what I was just different than what I expected.

Yeah. In terms of being a, again, I love coaching, I love my athletes, but in terms of being, uh, a colleague. With mostly male coaches. I that, I was surprised by that. Yeah. Um, and again, two things that maybe some didn't even weren't aware, but there was definitely a lot of insecurity there that I've experienced a lot of just ego.

Yeah. You know, you're a female and I dunno, well, based on, I mean, based on the conversations we've had while we work at the running store together, I mean, your girls, you have really done a lot for, for your girls. Yep. Mm-hmm. And now your future holds, you're gonna go off on your own Yep. And do some more coaching.

So actually Whitney mentioned we were already together for a few hours today. We were brainstorming about growing a coaching business for her. Mm-hmm. And doing some stuff with your love of animals, which now we're like, almost outta time. I know, because I wanna talk about like mm-hmm. All the dogs you have.

Oh yeah. There's your love of dogs. Mm-hmm. Um, and then a little bit about what you're dreaming about for your Yeah. What's coming. I, I mean, yeah. I think that's hard. Is um, I, yeah. To nick extent, I don't know. And that's why I asked Ally for help. Just in kind of helping me bridge that gap from here's an idea and how to execute it.

And again, that's what she's really, that's why she has this podcast. I wouldn't even know how to work this microphone without her. Um, and yeah, so that's kind of, yeah, I, we're kind of brainstorming. I, I know I love coaching. I, again, obviously my, most of my experience with half marathon Marathon, so I'd like to build a client base there.

Mm-hmm. Um, I have a lot of experience, again with mental health. And again, even as a dietician, I have experience with running and eating disorders. Um, and I feel like just I have a gift in connecting with, especially again, at this point my, in coaching, you know, I've worked mostly with high school athletes, so, you know, I've been able to, I think beyond coaching, running, I've been able to use a lot of kind of my past, um, mental health things.

And again, my, my dietician profession to work with a lot of athletes on that have struggled with eating disorders or struggling with depression, anxiety. Mm-hmm. Uh, in a way that maybe a lot of coaches. Wouldn't be able to do. Um, and I feel very grateful for those relationships that aren't just about running.

And I think a big thing I've always done in promote with my girls is using, running as an outlet for, again, some of those emotions. Mm-hmm. Um, some of that anxiety using the running to help again, whether it's through healing or using running to express themselves in a, you know, in a healthier way. Um, so again, feel fortunate that some of my own struggles have been able to help other, other girls.

Mm-hmm. And I'd like to continue that through coaching. It's interesting because I think back to being in high school, for me, I was, I had all of the confidence in the world. Mm-hmm. And I wish I could have bottled that up and have it now, because I feel like I relate a lot to what we're talking about now.

Maybe in my college years was when I really started to feel insecure. I mentioned that in my first episode and then now like. I don't know how people don't have anxiety. Mm-hmm. Like I just, for me, I have now really come to terms with my anxiety. I don't know that I've ever truly struggled with depression mm-hmm.

But definitely some postpartum stuff after having my first kid in particular. But, you know, going to therapy, being on, on medication has helped greatly. But I will say too, like I am right there with you and that running is such a positive outlet for me. Mm-hmm. Like if I, and I'm actually like seeing someone tomorrow because I think I'm maybe injured, I'm in denial.

Mm-hmm. But it hurt and then it didn't hurt. And I'm like, maybe it's not an injury. Mm-hmm. But I'm still gonna get it checked out just to make sure so that I, 'cause I, you know, the idea that I wouldn't be able to run right. Is terrifying. Mm-hmm. Because I have to use it for that. Right. Um, so, um, if anyone's interested in talking to Whitney about coaching, um, she is on Instagram as at Coach Bevins.

Just shoot her a note over there. I can also, I'll put it in the mm-hmm. In the show notes. I feel so fancy when I say that watch. Mm-hmm. I'm gonna put that in the show notes. Oh, yeah. I don't even know. Yeah. If you, you know, hopefully where to get those. Um, yeah. How do I find those? Oh, you just don't have to worry about it.

Okay. It's a link to your own profile, so you're good. Um, okay. And then so, so dogs too. Yes. So a weird transition there, but I, well, they have to provide you so much love. Yes. Oh my gosh. How many dogs do you have in your home right now? Currently? Five. Jesus. Currently five. It's a rotation. Um, yep. Five at the moment.

It kind of just depends on what comes my way. I did just turn down, I was asked to foster a senior dog and I just felt like I was at capacity. I would, I think that's a good, good call there. Yeah. Yeah. So I have two Chihuahuas, two corgis, and currently Rosemary Bear, who's this old Australian mix that. Okay.

I took on and she just exists. She's lovely. But, so yeah, there's five currently and yeah, I do. So I don't, I don't have children, so, uh, I guess I'm, you know, I'm the cliche dog mom, but they do like, I can't imagine life without them. And they, yeah, they're in their own way, they're healing, right? Yeah. They kinda sense when you need something.

And again, when I walk in the door, they're excited and, um, there's, I can't imagine walking into my home with no there. Um, yeah. Do they sleep with you? I can't remember. Oh yeah, four of them do. Four of four. Four do. Does Rosemary Bear? Can she knock on bed? Yeah. Rose. She can't outta the bed. Yeah. So, yeah.

Yeah. And two Chihuahuas and two Corgi sleep with me. It's, I think it's amazing. Uh, I can't speak, you know, for anybody else. I don't know that anybody else would love that fit. Yeah. Great. Yeah. I'm not sure. Um, but I love it. I mean, it's like, yeah. Super cozy and, uh, you know, yeah. So it's, I again, I love it, but I could see why, I could see why a lot of people wouldn't want four dogs in their bed.

Yeah. I can see, I can see that too. I mean, as somebody who like tries to keep my children outta my bed, it's like, how could you, I mean, it's hard enough sleeping with my husband for God's sakes, right? Like he sleeps diagonally, and I'm like, dude, can I just have my own my, yeah. Anyway, yeah. Um, okay. So we have to sadly yes.

Wrap this up, which sucks because Yeah. I feel like these conversations are too short. They're just, I could talk all day and there's so many things I could ask you about the things I know. Well, thank you. Yeah. Well, yeah. Um, so I have a couple questions Yes. For the end. Okay. And so one is a mantra. Mm-hmm.

Like a running mantra or song or both. What you got for me? Ooh. Uh, I don't run with music. Um, what. Um, what the hell, Christie? Who was Yeah, my last episode. She doesn't either and I like, don't get it. Yeah. I, I, uh, yeah, I can't run with music. I mean, I, I could, I guess I just don't, I just haven't, um, I, wow, that's fascinating to me.

I think I, one, I dunno, I just have to be so in tune with my breathing and Okay. Kind of want my body's doing, um, that I have he for, and, um, but I just, I found like I'm not fully, and this is just me like able to be in tune with kind of what my body is doing. Um, during a run, um, maybe to get faster, I need to not run with music.

Geez. No, no, no. I, I, I know people love it and it's probably great. Like, I just did a 13 mile run a few days ago and I was like, this is so boring. Um, and I was, yeah. Like, oh, you know, music may have been helpful. Um, no, I will, if I'm on a treadmill, I'll like just have music next to the treadmill. Yeah. And partly so I'm kind of weird.

I don't like things on your, on my head. Oh. So like right now, this is not cool. No, no. This is okay. Okay. But like, if I'm running, I don't, like, I'm kind of weird about things and what's touching me while I'm running, so that may be part of it too. Okay. Um, I don't, I don't know. I don't mantra. I don't really have mantra.

Well, we talked about, I remember when we first at the running store, we did some like bits together for Instagram about wisdom and I still will think about mm-hmm. The like, um. I dunno what you wanna call it. Like, almost like the road trip game where it's like one every mile you look like a, you look for like apples or like, I don't know what the fuck.

You're not see Apple. But I use that now. Like if I'm doing longer runs to distract my mind Sure. From some of that stuff. Yeah. So I, yeah, I mean, I'll have to come up with, so I guess there's nothing that's been so, well, what are you, what's on the re then we talked about like what if you could see in your mind what people, oh gosh.

Because you're saying, oh, you can't do this, and then you're saying you are the best. Or like, how do, what goes on in your mind? So for me it's, it's a transfer of pain. I think that's right. We also talked about that. Yeah, I like that too. Even though it's kind of weird. Yeah. It's a little dark. Uh, we do another episode.

Yeah. There's some darkness. Uh, no, I, but yeah, I, for me it's about being able to take either, again, maybe pain from whatever personal thing or just even again, kind of heal, dealing with my depression. And, um, running is a, I think for me, a way of, again, transferring pain from something else into that. Mm-hmm.

And then even within run. I, well, I think we talked about this. I'll Yeah. We did slap my leg or I'll grab a rock or something and create discomfort in another area. Start pounding and pounding it on your leg. Yeah. Yeah. Or just squeeze it. But yes, it is a little, it is a little dark. Um, but it's so, but I get it.

Yeah. But if it's like my, I'm so uncomfortable in this workout. I try to create pain someplace else to, I don't know, to take away from the discomfort of the run. Mm-hmm. So, I mean, it's basically just a distraction. Yeah. Um, but yeah, that's definitely something I probably do regularly. Uh, breathing I've, I've learned and, and something I, again, I work with on athletes is, um, something that's helped me a lot as a runner is cadence, uh Oh, right.

Yeah. In just my steps. Mm-hmm. So that's something I still, I think, even though it's more natural for me now. Is something I, I think I still work on well, ever since you and I have met, I've been trying to work on that too. Mm-hmm. Like the, you know, the metronome map and like, stuff like that. So yeah.

Whitney, gosh, we didn't even get into your time. Like working for New Balance and like Yeah. The form school stuff. I mean, we'll, you'll be back on at some point. Okay. Yeah. We'll, we, because we'll just continue this. We can do, yeah, there's a whole thing, whatever. There's so many, so we'll just like interject Whitney every once in a while for her wisdom because she has a lot of it and, okay.

So final thing, what, what's next in terms of the next finish line or milestone for you? Um, that's a good question. So I, I, again, I've put myself in a race, I realize I, I need to do that. So I'm running the mini again. I would say for me it's not competitive. I'm very weird about, like, I, I typically don't like to race unless I'm gonna win.

Yes. Yeah. Or I mean, I like, I get it. Yeah. I'm competitive. Um, so because I can't win, so I am running the mini, um, so basically like another stepping stone. Anything after that, it'll be actually putting like a marathon on the calendar. So I think right now I'm actually gonna be. Um, working with and representing Liam and, uh, Reese Kelly Foundation.

Oh, cool. Um, for monumental, um, they were two athletes at West Wallace Coaching who, uh, passed away. So Great. And, um, so the Liam and Reese Kelly Foundation, um, has a group in the marathon and it, I, yeah, I will be all right. I think running through this. Well, there you go. You said it. Yep. That's, that's really cool.

So, but what happens between now and, and then I'm, I'm sure there'll be some races on the calendar, but nothing official yet. Cool. While I'll be at the mini, I actually mm-hmm. Shout out to Bottleworks Hotel. Oh, yeah. I, I get a parent night out. Oh. Zach and I are gonna stay downtown at Bottleworks. Yes. We're gonna go to the garage.

Okay. Have you been there? Yes. For like pizza. Mm-hmm. And beer. And then like, just stay at the hotel and that's, go over to the Star. I've never stayed downtown the night before the mini, so what? Oh, that'd be perfect. I know. Good for you. So I'm super pumped. No kids. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm sure I'll see you. Okay.

You'll like be done way before me, but maybe we can share beer at, at the finish line. We'll see. Yeah. I've got some West sold athletes that are, um, they're track suit will be done, so they're actually gonna do the mini. Um, so I'll, I'll see them there. I don't know, we haven't talked about if I'll, if I'll run with them or just kind of, you know, see them at the start.

Yeah. I think, you know, that'll be fun for them and, and for me to see them kind of experience this experiencing the, you know, the mini that the, so the mini going, I know we're almost done, but the mini marathon, my dad, I ran, I was I think 12 years old, um, was my first half marathon. And you ran with your dad?

No, he, no, he, he ran, yeah, ahead and he just left me, but, but he signed me up and got me there and I ran it, uh, I think I ran 1 48. Um, wow. And so you're like one of those kids that passed me and mini I, I guess because thats the worst when you get past, I mean, it's hard enough getting passed by like somebody who's old, but like getting passed by a kid.

You're just like. God. Yeah, it's hilarious. Like, I think my hair was down. Oh, I'm sure. Yeah. I can picture, I, I believe the, uh, long, at the time it was like a long sleeve cotton shirt that was a race shirt. Perfect. Yep. Umbro. Um, of course, because there were no running clothes back. Yeah. You know, in the early nineties.

Yeah. Um, for especially someone, you know, my age. Yeah. Or you know, so anyway, yeah. So the Mini's always been a special thing for me. I think we know for a lot of people in India. Yeah. I'm so excited. So yeah. That'll be fun. Hopefully we have good weather. I've been stalking it. I know. Yeah. Fingers crossed.

It's so hit or miss. And, okay, so another milestone too is the launch of your website. We're gonna get there. The, we'll do it the launch of your website. Oh yeah. Because we're gonna do it. Okay. Yeah. And Alex will move that. Yeah. There's a lot of ideas, a lot of things in the works are usually are. Yeah.

Again, I like to. I like to run with dogs. We're talking about how to maybe expand that. My little indie in indie dog jogger as athlete. Yeah. Yeah. Help me with it. She'll run with your dog. I love that idea. My dog definitely needs to do that. Always get more. So, yeah. Well, yeah. We'll see. We're figuring it out again.

You know, you never quite feel like you're, you've got it figured out and I'm a testament to that. Yeah. Well, if anyone has it figured out, please like, let me know how, how you did that, because I don't know how people have it figured out, so. No. But yeah, I'm a master's runner now. Um, you've got a few years to go.

I know. I'm ready for that so that I can like maybe qualify for something. 'cause I gotta get older because I guess I'm in like the most competitive age range right now, which I didn't know, so I'm like, well, great. No wonder. Yeah. Well I was a little crushed. Uh, the, um, master's record at Monumental is actually one of the fastest times ever run.

It was run by Colleen Dera in, uh, maybe 2013. Uh, and she was four. I don't, she was in her early forties when she ran, uh, 2 36. Dang. Sounds like chew. Okay. That's a little aggressive. That's a little aggressive to like, Hey, I'm gonna smash my PR by over four minutes. Right, right. Yeah, it a matter six months. I gotta get, get it ready for that.

We'll get on that. That's fine. But oh gosh. Well, we'll see. Well, we could talk all day, so we better wrap this shit up here. Thank you all. Absolutely. I hope you've all enjoyed this conversation with Whitney Bes and as always, have a good weekend and happy running.

Ally Brettnacher