Episode 113: Mike Brydges - Through Discomfort Comes Progress

Episodes

Jun 20

Listener note: This episode includes discussion of depression, a suicide attempt, a family member's suicide, and cancer treatment.

Mike Brydges started running in 2018 because he could barely last 20 minutes on a treadmill. Now he's earned his Six Star medal, is chasing it a second time, and is aiming for a sub-three marathon.

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About this episode

Mike Brydges, known on Instagram as @mikerunsmarathons, grew up in South Jersey near Philadelphia and lived in New York City for 17 years. In 2018 he went through a mental health crisis, the loss of the great uncle who first told him it was okay to struggle, a string of surgeries, and dangerously high blood pressure, and he started running on a gym treadmill with a goal of lasting 20 minutes. He qualified for his first marathon, New York, through the NYRR 9+1 program and has since completed all six World Marathon Majors.

We talk about his Brooklyn Half after a car accident, running Boston with a kidney stone, his first sub-four at Tokyo, a 3:11 at the 2024 New York City Marathon, and starting the Six Star journey all over again. Mike also shares his everyday-runner interview series The Rundown, why he calls himself the anti Matt Choi, his playlists, and the mantra that gets him through: through discomfort comes progress.

In this episode, we discuss

How Mike picked the name Mike Runs Marathons and started making content in 2025
Hosting a small shakeout run before the Tokyo Marathon
Moving from New York City back to South Jersey
Running the Brooklyn Half the day after an Uber accident and a concussion
Running Boston with a kidney stone and needing a stent afterward
The mental health crisis, losses and health scares of 2018 that led him to running
Working up to 20 minutes on a gym treadmill and finding mental clarity
A NAMI 5K and qualifying for New York through the NYRR 9+1 program
His first marathon at the 50th New York City Marathon in 2021 and learning he needed orthotics
Getting into Berlin by lottery, missing sub-four by a fraction, and running Chicago and New York the same fall
London's plastic bottles, favorite NYRR races, and how to get into the Brooklyn and United Halfs
Breaking four hours at Tokyo and finishing his Six Star at Boston in 2024
Running 3:11 at the 2024 New York City Marathon and chasing sub-three with his best friend Chris
His interview series The Rundown and why he calls himself the anti Matt Choi
Video game boss music, Taylor Swift, his Peloton community, and the mantra "through discomfort comes progress"

Chapters

00:00 · Intro
04:00 · Mike Runs Marathons on Instagram
07:00 · From New York City to South Jersey
09:00 · A car accident before the Brooklyn Half
13:00 · Running Boston with a kidney stone
15:30 · 2018 and finding running
22:30 · NAMI 5K and the NYRR 9+1
25:00 · Living with depression
30:00 · First marathon: New York 2021
38:00 · The Disney marathon
40:00 · Berlin, Chicago and New York in one fall
47:30 · London and racing in New York
59:30 · Tokyo, Boston and the first Six Star
1:06:00 · Chasing a sub-three marathon
1:09:30 · The Rundown and the anti Matt Choi
1:18:30 · Playlists, mantra, Peloton and what's next

Where to find Mike

Instagram: @mikerunsmarathons

Mentioned in this episode

Races: New York City Marathon, Brooklyn Half Marathon, United Airlines NYC Half, Broad Street Run, Boston Marathon, Tokyo Marathon, Berlin Marathon, Chicago Marathon, London Marathon, Walt Disney World Marathon, Philadelphia Marathon, Queens 10K, NYRR Pride Run, Abbott Dash to the Finish Line 5K, Monumental Marathon, Big Cottonwood Marathon, Marine Corps Marathon, Warsaw Marathon, Barcelona Marathon
Organizations and charities: New York Road Runners, NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness), Achilles International, Boston Athletic Association, Peloton, Runna, Strava
Other: Matt Choi, Susie Chan, Conner Mantz, Taylor Swift, Chappell Roan, Positive Peloton group

Related episodes

Frequently asked

Who is Mike Runs Marathons?

Mike Runs Marathons is Mike Brydges, a South Jersey runner and consultant who started running in 2018, has completed all six World Marathon Majors, and shares everyday runner stories on Instagram.

How did Mike Brydges get into the New York City Marathon?

Mike Brydges earned his entry through New York Road Runners' 9+1 program, running nine NYRR races and volunteering at one in 2019, and ran the 50th New York City Marathon in 2021 after the 2020 race was canceled.

What is Mike Brydges' marathon PR?

Mike Brydges ran 3:11 at the 2024 New York City Marathon, his fastest marathon, and is now chasing a sub-three-hour marathon.

Why did Mike Brydges start running?

Mike Brydges started running on a treadmill in 2018 after a very difficult year for his mental and physical health, including a doctor's warning about his high blood pressure, and found that running gave him a sense of calm.

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Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically, so it may contain errors.

This is a Sandy Boy Productions podcast. Ally: Welcome to Finish Lines and Milestones, a podcast celebrating the everyday runner. I'm your host, Ally Brettnacher, and if you run, you are a runner and every runner has a story. Join me every Friday as I share these stories and we celebrate finish lines and milestones together. This week I'm interviewing Mike Bridges, who is, Mike runs marathons on Instagram. But before I get to Mike, I wanted to talk about the downhill Boston qualifying drama because. If you don't already know this, if you're new to listening to this because of Mike, I am based in Indianapolis, Indiana, and we have the Indianapolis Monumental Marathon on November 8th this year, and we are a top rated, non net downhill Boston qualifier marathon.

So I'm just saying if you're really bummed and you wanna run a fast marathon, come see us in Indianapolis in the fall, we will sell out. This year for sure. So if you're not decided on your fall marathon, come do that. And I am gonna get judged for this, but I've run the very downhill big Cottonwood Marathon or half marathon out in Salt Lake City and totally, when I found out it was a Boston qualifying course, I was like, well, I'm gonna come back here and run my bq. I need all the help I can get. And that race was actually my PR for a while, which felt like cheating.

And so I totally understand why the BAA is trying to level the playing field, but if they could just stop changing things. That would be cool. 'cause I just wanna be able to set the goal, be able to see what it is and go get it, versus being like, I don't know, but I'm just chasing my best. So if I don't get there, that's cool. I'll still be at my very best. And then I also wanted to mention my treadmill running this week. It's so hot. It's gotten really humid in Indiana, and I know I shouldn't complain 'cause it was just winter, but I ended up running nine miles on my treadmill this week because I wanted to avoid the heat and humidity.

And I put the question out there to ask how far people have run on the treadmill. And so I just had to shout out my friend Kimberly, because she told me she's run. Not one, but two ultra marathons, ultra marathons, that's 31.1 miles on her treadmill. And she told me one of those times she was pregnant. So anyway, if you think running a few miles on the treadmill is hard, just think about that. And there were a ton of other people who have done 20 milers. And you know, for me, I've never done a 20 miler on the tread, but I've done in the double digits.

I can't remember exactly how far. But I am a treadmill runner. I love my treadmill, especially love watching the new season of Jenny and Georgia on Netflix, so you'll find me on my treadmill a lot this summer, probably as I gear up training for the Marine Corps marathon in late October. So now let's get to Mike. So Mike Bridges and I met via Instagram as many of my guests and I have, he lives in New York and we talk a lot about that. The New York races, he's done, he's done all of them, I think pretty much. So he kind of gives us the inside scoop about that for people who are not from New York and he is chasing his six star medal.

For the second time, not once, but twice. When he finished the first time, he is like, well, now what? And just decided, oh, I'll do it again. So we're following him now on his journey in round two, so again, make sure you go follow his journey. I also love how he is dedicated to meeting the everyday runner, sharing everyday runner stories. Obviously if you're here, you like that too. So again, be sure to check out his Instagram and the stuff he's doing over there. He also, in his profile, this is what sold me on Mike. I was like, he is the anti Matt Choi. That's what he said.

And if you don't know who Matt Choi is, he's the running influencer that had E-bikes. During the New York City marathon and he's done other stuff like that, like no shade to influencers, but like when you're putting other runners in danger so that you can create content, that's just not what it's about. So that's why I really liked Mike, and I'm so happy that I finally got to sit down with him and get to know him. And I know that you are gonna be really inspired by this conversation with Mike Bridges. Ally: Hey, Mike. How's it going? I'm Mike: I'm good. How Ally: How yourself Doing?

All right. I am so glad you're finally here. Mike: Me too. It's been a long time Ally: It's been a long time coming. Yeah. And anybody who doesn't know you or follow your journey yet, you are. Mike runs marathons on Instagram, which I love. Yeah. Mike: I, I went through like three or four different names and then I, I'm pretty sure it came to me like on a run. I came back I was talking to my wife. I was like, I think I found my name. Mike runs Ally: Marathon. I was like, I guarantee you. Mike: has that name. Ally: Yeah. Mike: And Ally: And then I typed it in.

I was like, oh, Mike: the Ally: the email address is taken. Mike: but the username was not. So I Ally: So I was like, Mike: okay, cool. I Ally: I got lucky with that. Yeah, I'm actually really surprised about that. When did you get on Instagram for running in particular? Um. Mike: probably during the pandemic, I went through like different names and I, I kind of like posted here and there, but it was mostly just like, here's what I did today with my run. And that was kind of it. Ally: Yeah. And now so much content you're getting, you're telling runner stories, which is so cool.

Mike: I know, I know. It's, I, I, I have to give a shout out to my wife because I was supposed to try to start doing content last year. but then like, somehow the year just flew by and I was like, Ally: Oh, I guess I can't start, Mike: in 2024. Ally: so Mike: my, I was Ally: was like, I think I'm gonna start 2025. Mike: my wife was like, do it. Ally: So Mike: I Ally: kind of Mike: forced Ally: myself to start by buying, like, Mike: that I had to make Ally: myself be like, yeah, it's Mike: amount of Ally: money. Mike: you are going to be using it and if you don't use it, then you waste your money Ally: Right?

So it's an incentive not to waste your money. Yeah. I feel that. Mike: I'm, I'm so grateful, for what has happened in my life over the last five months with, with running, because I, Ally: I never thought that people would Mike: listen to what I had to say. Uh, Ally: tell me about it. Mike: I thought it was just like, I'd throw it out in the ethos and just like, if people catch it, like, that's wonderful. to, to have people, you know, message me and, and tell me that I inspire them or tell me their own stories, just, it's just wild. I mean, I was able to do a shakeout run before the Tokyo Marathon, which if you had said that to me at any point in my life, I would've said you were nuts.

Ally: Tell me more about that. yeah, I, I Mike: had Ally: had started Mike: content probably Ally: probably for Mike: months, and I was like, Hey, let me just put a Google form together. If anybody wants to join, they can. I mean, it was very Ally: small Mike: it was supposed to be like Ally: three, four, Mike: but only two showed up. But listen. One, person makes a difference. Ally: Mm-hmm. Mike: you know, it, it was, I just remember Ally: Running. We were running around the Mike: Palace and I remember doing it. We were talking and, just thinking Ally: thinking the entire, Mike: how Ally: how is this, Mike: life?

Like, how Ally: how is this? Mike: Like, I'm in Japan. I've, Ally: I Mike: met Ally: met up with people following me on Mike: media from Ally: around the country Mike: somehow Ally: somehow we are running Mike: this like Ally: incredibly. Mike: distinctive building that yeah, Ally: Like even now, just this like, oh my god. Yeah. gosh. Yeah. It has to feel like a dream. okay, so there's so much that we have to get into during this conversation because even though you've been running since, you know, 20 18, 20 19, you've packed a lot into that short, long amount of time. I mean, I guess it's all relative, right?

'cause it's still been years that you've been doing this, but you've accomplished so much in such a short amount of time. So tell, tell the people where you are are from and where you're, where I'm talking to you from. Mike: so I Ally: So I grew up in South Jersey, near Philly. Mike: I lived here until I was 18, and then I moved to New York City for college and lived there for 17 years, and Ally: Wow. Mike: moved back in 2022. went through, my, my grandma at the time was, was very sick. She unfortunately passed away, you know, Ally: you know, we, we moved out here by my Mike: Then Ally: fiance.

We moved down here to Mike: be Ally: be closer to her doing everything. Mike: and Ally: And plus New York City just got really, really, Mike: And Ally: and my wife, Mike: had always wanted to live in New Ally: New York City, and Mike: and it is Ally: it was just like this weird Mike: like Ally: COVID thing. And then we were doing long distance for about a year and a half. Mike: and then I Ally: I decided Mike: to Ally: Florida Mike: to Ally: be near her and her family Mike: lived Ally: lived there for about eight months, and then Mike: got a Ally: job up in New York City again.

Mike: and Ally: She was like, Hey, I've always wanted to live in New York City now. Mike: try it out. And Ally: And she came in. Mike: so Ally: after the first year of our lease, Mike: and living there, we were Ally: they're like, you know what? Mike: for Ally: for her sanity, I was like, let's get outta here. Plus Mike: in my Ally: my opinion New York City changed so much since the pandemic that I just, Mike: I, Ally: I can't even realize anymore. So I, I still go up there for races. I go up there, see my friends, but Mike: it's Ally: it's nice to be able to visit, but.

Mike: be able to leave. Ally: Yeah, , so I'm from Indiana, so if you can imagine like me coming to New York, it's obviously very different from where I live. I live in the suburbs of Indianapolis and it's like exactly like you would picture suburbia. Like that is where I live. And I don't think I've been to New York City since before the pandemic. ' the last time I was in the city would've been for the 2019 New York City Marathon I spectated that year. Mike: Okay. Ally: And for some friends that had cheered me on the year prior, and I think that's the last time.

So I was there like right before the pandemic I guess. But then I haven't been back, which is so sad. I need to take my kids there. Mike: Yeah, I Ally: Yeah. Mike: it's a Ally: It's a beautiful city, but it's, it's, Mike: in my opinion, so many more issues now that need to be worked out. Ally: So, okay, so that's how you got to run Brooklyn was, as we're recording this, Brooklyn was last weekend, right? Was it? I don't. Okay. I was like, I feel like it was just yesterday and I don't know. So how was that race for you? Mike: Uh, it Ally: Uh, it was a struggle.

Mike: so the day before, I, I had traveled the week prior for work. I was in Georgia and I had flown up to New York to go get my bib and I was gonna go finish working at our office and got an Uber. And I was like, okay. So I will take my Uber to downtown Brooklyn, pick up my bib, and then Uber again up to, uh, the office. And Ally: On there. Mike: Uber driver got into an accident Ally: What? That's wild. Yeah. Mike: three car pile up. It was wonderful. And, um, Ally: Great. Mike: was actually kind of like lying down. I had my seatbelt on, but I was lying down, like trying to take a nap.

'cause I had woken up very Ally: Early, Mike: I was Ally: very tired. And so I heard that beeping sound Mike: get when you get too close to a Ally: hard. Oh hmm. Mike: it, Ally: And I noticed that it wasn't stopping and I was Mike: We're Ally: about to hit something. Mike: And Ally: So I braced and Mike: I, Ally: what shoulda taken me about 45 minutes, six hours Mike: just to Ally: get Mike: downtown Brooklyn from JFK, which was just like insane. I Ally: I had to roll my suitcase, Mike: you know, probably 30 Ally: blocks in order to get some way and then go up and, Mike: and Ally: and that night, so I got my bib and that night I started to feel like Mike: weird.

I, I Ally: I got really bad migraine. I started, Mike: really dizzy. I Ally: started to feel, oh, Mike: like weak. Ally: woke up the next day. I only got like two hours of sleep. Mike: so I Ally: I woke up the next day for the Brooklyn half and Mike: I felt a Ally: got a little nauseous and I was Mike: let me do like my Ally: okay Mike: like traditional Pre-race, routine that Ally: That I've Mike: thought that Ally: that might help. It Mike: kind of Ally: kind did, but not really. I knew something was wrong when I tried to Mike: one of my Martin Joes before the Ally: race, Mike: and like gagged.

So I Ally: I got to a mile or Mike: in, Ally: prospect Mike: going around it before you had all the way down to Coney Island. Ally: and got about a quarter way up and I, Mike: like I was Ally: I was just gonna throw up. I was so nauseous, I Mike: I Ally: felt so sick and Mike: I Ally: ended up having to log for a little bit. I was texting my wife, I was like, Mike: I Ally: I dunno if be would do this. Mike: I Ally: I think my DNF I've never DNF race before. Yeah. And um, Mike: I Ally: I was like, you know, I think what might happen is I'll get to the top prospect part.

Everybody will go around it. I'll just keep going Mike: and Ally: and I'll leave. but then I kind of like Mike: I was Ally: trying to Mike: bargain with Ally: with myself. I was like, okay, let's Mike: see how Ally: how you feel at the bottom of Prospect Park around, but Mike: and Ally: see how it, Mike: And Ally: and by the time I got down. Mike: the Ally: Humidity. That was like 96% Mike: dropped a little bit and there Ally: there was a, so I started to Mike: little Ally: little better. Mike: I Ally: I had a Mike: a Ally: little more, Mike: towards the middle part of the race, Ally: but Mike: was able to finish, Ally: still Mike: time.

I missed my Ally: time. Mike: by like minutes, I think. but yeah, Ally: yeah, it. Mike: a struggle. I had struggled with that. And then the week before I had done, uh, a 10 mile race in Philly. And, same Ally: Same thing. Humidity hit Mike: real Ally: real bad. Mile three I like, like Mike: was like, Ally: I don't wanna, Mike: anymore. Ally: but I still finish. And Mike: And, Ally: this is what I'm starting to recognize for my bicycle. Mike: this is when the hard part Ally: The starts, especially Mike: with running, especially with training Ally: for fall. Mm-hmm. Mike: the Ally: Humidity. I take a medication that makes over, Mike: So, Ally: oh, Mike: so, Ally: so, and I used to run with water, but now I don't Mike: I just, I don't have enough Ally: because Mike: I, I Ally: I don't wear a belt anymore Mike: carry my phone in my Ally: hand.

It can be a struggle Mike: But yeah, I, uh, I finished at least Ally: Yeah. What was the Philly 10 miler? Is that the Big 10 miler they have there? Because I know there's one that's like really big. Mike: the Broad Street run. Ally: That's right. Okay. 'cause I have a friend, a running friend actually, who lives in Philly, so yeah. shout out Kim, if you're listening, but man, that's, I can't believe you got in a car accident, slept two hours, and then still did a race. That's, that's painful, man. That's Congrats on finishing because it's easy just to stop. It Mike: It was, Ally: was, it was a struggle and I had several people Mike: yell at Ally: at me Mike: being Ally: like Mike: a Ally: a couple weeks prior.

Mike: I had run Boston. I had a kidney stone. Ally: Oh my God. I can, I really need to hear this story because I could not believe this. Mike: Yeah, Ally: Yeah. It was Mike: um, was on a, Ally: a, Mike: yeah, Ally: also was on a Monday. I was in hospital Mike: hospital Ally: that Friday Mike: before because I Ally: I. Mike: okay, I definitely know that I have one, I have a history of them. and Ally: so we went to the er, they did a CAT scan. They're like, good thing, Mike: The Ally: worst part's over. Mike: it's Ally: We out Mike: be Ally: on.

I was like, great. I cash over for the marathon, Mike: kept Ally: kept checking Mike: and was like, maybe I missed it. Maybe it did come out. I Ally: I dunno, Mike: So Ally: ran the marathon, Mike: was Ally: fine. Mike: And Ally: And then I came home to Tuesday. Mike: and that Ally: night I Mike: started to Ally: to get pain Mike: I Ally: and Mike: wife take Ally: take me to the hospital and Mike: were Ally: they were like, okay, let's do another CAT scan. And they were like, the kidney stone is stuck. Oh my gosh. So, Mike: So Ally: so they were like, we have to keep you.

Mike: you here and we Ally: Oh no. Mike: I Ally: I was like, oh my God. Mike: So I Ally: I had taken it off, Mike: two Ally: two days already Mike: for the Ally: for the marathon. I had to take the rest of the weight off. Mike: I'm Ally: I'm not sure. I'm sure some, Mike: some Ally: people will know what this is. They had to install a stent Mike: into Ally: my kidney, which is. Mike: a giant metal tube that goes from your kidney out of you. and it was very painful. I Ally: I got it taken out, Mike: Tuesday Ally: before the broad run Mike: and then I had the Broad Street Ally: run.

Mike: So Ally: there was that and then there was, Mike: con I I found out I had a concussion. 'cause I get, I did go to the Ally: er Mike: when I got back Ally: I was gonna ask you that 'cause it seems like something was off for sure. Yeah. Mike: I had a concussion from that, so I had those two things happen like one week after another, and I'm, I'm Ally: I'm happy that this Mike: there was Ally: was, Mike: health Ally: yeah. Geez, Mike, that's, I mean, just one of those things is a ton to go through, let alone like two in that short amount of time.

Mike: Yeah. Yeah. But I Ally: Golly. Mike: um, I always tell myself I've been through worse, so, you know, it's, I can get through that. Ally: Right? Yeah. what do you do for your day job, by the way? So, Mike: So Ally: I'm a consultant. Okay. Mike: I, I work for a company primarily that, I mean, we do commercial consulting, but I work with government consulting. So I help states with a variety of different issues they might be facing, Ally: So you travel a lot for work then, or just sometimes or? Uh, Mike: it's Ally: sometimes. Usually once a month. Okay. Okay. So not depends on it depends on the project.

Mike: I'm working on. Ally: Gotcha. And so let's go back again to when you started running in the first place. So where were you living at the time that you started running? Mike: I was Ally: I was living in, Mike: in New York. Ally: okay. Mike: you know, I I, I like telling the story because it's, it, a lot of people, Ally: As I tell the story that like, Mike: then this, and then this, because it Ally: because it was just like, Mike: cascade of issues after the other. Ally: so Mike: uh, in Ally: February, 2018 Mike: bad mental health Ally: issues, Mike: I was, trying Ally: trying to find Mike: know, the right Ally: indication to help me.

Mike: it just kind of wasn't, we Ally: we weren't finding it. And I, I got put on one medication that Mike: up Ally: up causing Mike: essentially Ally: paranoid. I wasn't Mm. Mike: I wasn't Ally: Being, Mike: and Ally: and that culminated in me Mike: to take my life Ally: trying Mike: in Ally: in February. I was in the hospital for a couple days Mike: Um, Because Ally: because of that. And Mike: about a Ally: a month later, after getting a, my Mike: my, girlfriend at the Ally: at the time, we've been Mike: for Ally: about three years, she up with me saying that. Mike: saying that what I had gone through was too much for her, which I and I understand, you know, it's, if I was in her position, I would kind of feel the same way and in, in a sense.

I Ally: I was also in like really intensive therapy at the time. Mike: like three times a week, including like, group therapy. And, and I Ally: I finally Mike: decided, you Ally: you Mike: this was gonna be like the time where I Ally: I gonna, Mike: taking that very seriously and figuring out my mental health issues and, and trying to solve them. And Ally: then, uh, so that started to work. Mike: very Ally: Gradually. Very. Mike: And Ally: And then in April of 20, Mike: I Ally: I lost my, uh, great uncle, my grandfather, brother. Mike: I Ally: I grew up with a, Mike: mother household.

I Ally: I dunno who my dad is. Mike: And so Ally: so I've been lucky enough to have my grandpa and Mike: him as kind of my Ally: father, Mike: and Ally: and he was one of the nicest men I've ever Mike: he Ally: was a big, a big advocate for mental health. Mike: He had Ally: He had bipolar. And Mike: he was the Ally: the first person ever tell me, you know, it's okay to have a health issue, Mike: You just have to get Ally: get it checked and take care of it and you'll be okay. Mike: there's Ally: Nothing wrong with you, you're not broken.

Mike: It's just something that Ally: So that would just have to, Mike: with. And Ally: so Mike: it was Ally: really refreshing. Mike: him say that to me Ally: And so when I lost him, it really hurt me because I couldn't go to his funeral Mike: and Ally: I had not seen him Mike: a couple years. So, That was, that Ally: that was really heartbreaking. Mike: and Ally: And my grandpa's a very, very stoic man, Mike: And I Ally: and I remember calling him, Mike: he lost him and they Ally: they did everything together Mike: went on trips together. you know, Ally: that he was essentially the only sibling, Mike: that he spoke to, and he had five Ally: brothers.

Mike: sisters. Ally: Geez. Mike: and Ally: and so I remember calling him and couldn't even speak. Mike: He was just sobbing and I was just heart. I was broken. and then Ally: then a month after that, kind of in conjunction, I Mike: found Ally: out that I had an Mike: that Ally: needed taken care of, kind of immediate anywhere else. Mike: culminated in cancer. Ally: And so, Mike: uh, Ally: essentially. Mike: rest of 2018, I had to have surgeries. About Ally: every two weeks. Mike: kind of stave this Ally: I sleep long. Mike: the Ally: The worst part was that I would, Mike: I had Ally: I had one big surgery Mike: which was Ally: in just Mike: the, I, the Ally: worst thing probably I've ever had in my life.

Mike: But Ally: But then the rest of the year I had to have surgery Mike: work. Ally: and so Mike: go Ally: seven in the morning to the doctor, Mike: do the Ally: do the procedure, and then I would go to work and have to act like Mike: was fine. and then I Ally: I also decided to finally go Mike: see a Ally: primary doctor Mike: I started to get really bad Ally: migraine Mike: the point where I would, I would throw Ally: up. Mike: and it, it Ally: It got, Mike: it Ally: it got really bad Mike: so Ally: so I went to go see him and Mike: found out Ally: out that my blood pressure was just like Mike: abysmally Ally: high.

It was like Mike: 180, 1 90 over like 90, over a hundred or over 90, a hundred or something Ally: something like that. And it was, Mike: it was Ally: was to the point where he like. Mike: I. Ally: If you don't start doing something, Mike: you are gonna have Ally: have had some stroke Mike: heart Ally: a heart attack and strokes around the middle side of my belly, Mike: Um, and Ally: And so Mike: I Ally: I took Mike: kind of Ally: all of that, Mike: all of Ally: of those events together to be like, okay, I need to Mike: I need Ally: do Mike: do Ally: something that's gonna Mike: help me lose Ally: weight and get healthy.

Mike: You know, Ally: You know, Mike: I'm Ally: I'm not trying to shout, like, Mike: at Ally: everybody about their weight, but like my doctor was very Mike: He was very Ally: like, Mike: direct with Ally: with me because Mike: it's Ally: what I needed. Mm-hmm. And Mike: so Ally: I, Mike: I Ally: started to think about what I could do and Mike: I Ally: I had tried running, Mike: like, I Ally: I dunno, maybe Mike: nine Ally: years before that, but it was like, Mike: I'd Ally: I'd run around my block and it Mike: be Ally: just like destroyed my, Mike: And Ally: and so I was, Mike: I Ally: I, I went to the gym.

And Mike: and I looked Ally: I looked around and I was very self-conscious at the time, so I was like, I'm not gonna wait. Mike: I Ally: I don't wanna be around all of these people that have all these muscles that I don't have and feel judged, and I don't wanna hurt myself in the mirror. Mike: and Ally: so I, I gravitated towards running and I, I Mike: got on Ally: on the trip home for the first time, and I, I Mike: never Ally: forget this, but whenever you hit start on the treadmill, it would just start for 20 minutes. Mike: And I Ally: I made it a Mike: a Ally: goal that I wanted to be able to run.

Mike: those Ally: was 20 minutes from mm-hmm. Mike: And at Ally: at the burn, it was terrible. Mike: I Ally: hated it. Mike: I Ally: I was Mike: really, Ally: really struggling. I would have to run, walk. My pace was very, very slow. but eventually Mike: I Ally: I got the 20 minutes Mike: and I felt a Ally: ipo, a really great intent of accomplishment. And I also realized Mike: while Ally: running Mike: that I Ally: I start to get this Mike: mental Ally: clarity Mike: that Ally: I, Mike: I Ally: I never really got. anywhere else? Mike: I Ally: Mm. I felt like this sense of calmness, Mike: kind Ally: kind of everything that was Mike: like Ally: in my head that was just like Mike: yelling at Ally: at me Mike: or Ally: just wouldn't be quiet, Mike: just Ally: finally just Mike: died Ally: down.

Mike: And I, I Ally: I realized, you know, maybe, Mike: maybe Ally: this is what I Mike: do Ally: to destress and Mike: it, it Ally: kind of escalated from, Mike: I Ally: I mean, I ended up, I didn't run off dock. Mike: It was also the Ally: I was gonna ask you if you remembered your first outdoor run after this point, but it was winter. Yeah. Mike: my Ally: My first outdoor run. Mike: 2019 Ally: Okay. Mike: I wanna say May, I started running in like. August, September of 2018. So like that whole time period was inside. Ally: Okay. And it was at a gym where other people were Correct?

Yeah. Mike: Yeah. so I ran like my first five KI ran my first 10 KI may have Ally: Broke my first 15 K on the treadmill, and my biggest fear was like, Mike: I'm Ally: I'm running on a treadmill, so it's helping me go Mike: If Ally: if I go on nine and I have to up my own. Mike: in, am I going to be slower? Ally: Mm. Mike: and I Ally: And I remember going outside for the first time Mike: and Ally: and running and being very happy because it wasn't that much of a different end. Mike: at Ally: at the time I hit the cold, I have rain on, so my hands, my feet always cold Mike: always cold.

And during Ally: during the winter, almost Mike: solid Ally: and perfect. Mm. even if I wear gloves. Mike: And Ally: So, , That was my Mike: like Ally: rationale running by. Mike: And Ally: After running outside, I was like, I, Mike: I Ally: I really liked it. Mike: And Ally: So I, I got very lucky that my, my therapy I was going was right by Central Park. So Mike: I would finish work, Ally: go Mike: go Ally: go to the gym Mike: around the corner, pack my stuff up, and then just go to Ally: Central. Mike: And I, I, I ran in Central Park. God, I don't even know how many times for over the last, over Ally: Over the next, Mike: years.

, And, , I, Ally: I, I didn't wanna run a marathon at all. I, I just wanted to Mike: able to get Ally: meet it and stay healthy. And, Mike: I Ally: I had, Mike: well, I don't know if it was that winter, I Ally: I found out about 5K that was happening with Mike: nami, the Ally: National Lines for Mental Illness Mike: and Ally: decided to Mike: run Ally: that and raise money for them. Mike: And it Ally: it was a, it was an excellent experience. I actually think that was the last one they ever Mike: because I think Ally: came. After that transitioned.

Mike: walk. Ally: But Mike: after Ally: doing that, I was like, I'm not, I've never really been a competitive person. I've never done sports before. Um, but running that race different. Mike: seeing people and be like, can I pass them? Can I, I wanna beat them. Can I get Ally: Get to the finish line before they, they can. Mike: and Ally: and so I, I kind of Mike: bit Ally: got bit by like Mike: race Ally: book, but I didn't know what I wanted to do because I, I didn't know anything about like Mike: Road runners I Ally: I didn't about Mike: and was it called MYC races or NYC runs?

or Ally: any other organization that helped races. Mike: in the city? I, Ally: I just knew that it was a lot of Mike: and I had a Ally: people. And I had a friend, Mike: whose Ally: best friend, friend from New York actually in 28. Mike: in Ally: 2019. I Mike: it was, I. Probably like Ally: was Mike: probably April, may. I was like, Ally: like, you know what? Mike: I Ally: I think I gonna try qualify for the New York City Marathon by doing their nine Mike: one Ally: one program. Mike: And I Ally: I had a friend tell me, uh, and this is what Mike: I Ally: I have to shout out to Darren, Mike: he's Ally: use them.

Mike: sparked my, my Ally: Marathon. Mike: running. He said, you Ally: You don't have enough time to, Mike: And Ally: so I signed for Mike: races and Ally: and started in finished Mike: the first week of Ally: of October Mike: and was qualified for Ally: 20. And Mike: and obviously got canceled. So I ran it in 2021 and that, that's, that started everything. Ally: so, so the nine plus one for New York City Roadrunners, you do nine of their races and then you get into New York? Is that, am I understanding that right? Mike: you have to do nine Ally: Of their races. Mike: then volunteer at one.

Ally: Okay. That's crazy. That's kind of cool though, to have that opportunity, especially when you live close enough to do that, Mike: Yeah. Yeah. And that's, that's one that was one of the benefits of living in New York. Ally: right? Yeah. I wanna go back to kind of the beginning of what we were just going through that 'cause that was a lot, that's a lot that you've gone through. And so up until the point in 2018. Like, had you dealt with mental health, like looking back now, like what you know now? Like had you struggled with your mental health for a long time? Mike: Yes.

Yeah. I've, I've had, I, I depression since I, I mean, fifth grade, I know exactly when I knew I, I became depressed because I was yelling at myself and calling myself an idiot when I was in fifth grade. and, I didn't Ally: I didn't really start taking it serious. Mike: my, my Ally: My great, Mike: son, he, he took his life. And so I Ally: I realized, you know, I don't Mike: want to Ally: wanna end up like Mike: I Ally: starting therapy. And I started trying to find psychiatrist company Mike: and Ally: and it just, it was, Mike: I Ally: I don't really remember most of money Mike: because Ally: because rest Mike: and, Ally: I, I'm happy that Mike: you know, I, Ally: I, I ended up finding a therapist who, Mike: who understood my needs and was able to find me someone who would be able to help me.

Ally: and Mike: I Ally: I contribute. Mike: of my, my healing with Ally: with my mental health to the, uh, Mike: the, uh, the Ally: the therapy program that was, that I was in, and the therapist that helped me, Mike: and the Ally: psychiatrist, that helped me because, Mike: they Ally: they saw me at my lowest. They were the ones that were there for me when, Mike: when I Ally: when I tried to take my life and Mike: instead Ally: of Mike: you know, Ally: kind of pushing me out or Mike: or not wanting Ally: wanting to help me, they, they kind of Mike: wrap their Ally: their services around.

Right. Mike: and made sure that I was all right. But Ally: Yeah. Mental health has been a Mike: big Ally: struggle for me my, my entire life. Mike: it Ally: runs my family. My mom Mike: my brother Ally: has Mike: pretty Ally: sure my grandfather has Mike: He doesn't Ally: talk about feeling. Mike: he, he gives off a, a lot of the signs. Ally: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, and what people talk about more now, thankfully, well, is mental health in general and then like also the medication side of things because I've been on antidepressants, anti-anxiety medication now for four years, and it's not an exact science too, like where you just go take a pill and you feel better.

It's like. It's a really, it has to be, not just the meds, but what you're talking about, like having a therapist, having a psychiatrist perhaps. And then you know, also, obviously you found running, which is great, but it's been an ongoing struggle for me and I'm sure for many of people who are listening as well. Mike: Yeah. Ally: so it's just like, you know, like your great uncle said to you, you're not alone, you're not broken like this. I think probably more people than not like have deal with anxiety and depression these days. Anyway. Mike: Yeah, it's, Ally: It's funny, whenever I go to, Mike: new psychiatrist now.

or talk to a new therapist. They, they ask me like, what's your medication history? And I'm like, well, if you can name a, an Ally: yeah, Mike: I've been on it. Like I've been on nearly every single thing that you can name of. And so whenever I tell them that, they're like, Ally: Okay, so Mike: can't Ally: can try these. Yeah. Right. And it's like, I just got this, I don't know this DNA test done, I forget what it's called, but it's like it helps you look at what medicines might work better for you or which ones you should stay away from. Mike: Oh, wow.

Ally: So I did that and actually mine ended up not being that helpful 'cause it's like I don't really have negative reactions to many. Mike: Mm. Ally: so it just kind of confirmed what we've been trying, which is good. Mike: Yeah. Ally: but you know, with all the side effects it can tell you like, Hey, you really shouldn't take this 'cause it's, it's probably gonna give you some gnarly side effects. but yeah, I think about, you know, what you went through in February of 2018. Did they like looking back, was it part of the meds you were on too? Because I know sometimes that can cause suicidal thoughts and then actions.

I mean, that's just so scary. Mike: Yeah, that, that I, I contribute a lot of it to the medication I was on at the time Ally: Ugh. Mike: I start, I started to get paranoid. I, I thought that, like I lived in a studio apartment. You walked into my apartment, you could see everything. I thought that someone was going to come out of like my bathroom, which you can't get into my bathroom unless you're in my apartment. Ally: Yeah, Mike: Um, I, I was afraid to open the windows 'cause I thought someone would be staring back at me. Like it was, it was terrify terrifying.

And, um, one thing I, Ally: I, Mike: say actually, that I forgot to mention is I, I remember when Ally: when I Mike: did the act, I Ally: was lying on the ground, Mike: and Ally: I Mike: kind Ally: kind of realized what I had done, Mike: And I Ally: heard this really, really, Mike: really Ally: clean Mike: that Ally: like, I don't, Mike: I, Ally: I, I Mike: tell Ally: myself like, it wasn't mine. I don't know whose it was, but it wasn't mine. Mike: And Ally: And all it said was not yet. Mike: And Ally: that is what Mike: made Ally: me get up.

Mike: up. Ally: Oh my gosh. I, Mike: I, Ally: like, Mike: I don't Ally: I don't wanna get graphic. I Mike: wrapped Ally: myself Mike: in like a bunch of t-shirts and I, I Ubered to the hospital, Ally: gosh. Mike: yeah, to, um, to get help. But I don't, I don't think, if I, if I Ally: I didn't hear that voice. I dunno. Mike: I Ally: I dunno. Mike: would be today. Ally: Are you, I mean, you didn't mention God, so does that mean, are, are you not religious at all or are you, Mike: I, I Ally: I dunno what I'm, I I think that there's, Mike: when, when I was, if you had asked me when I was younger, I, I mean I was gonna become a deacon when I was a kid.

Ally: wow. Okay. Mike: but, but Ally: Now I Mike: think I'm, I'm Ally: probably more Mike: spiritual than Ally: than anything. Say I probably, Mike: towards Buddhism Ally: and Mike: probably Ally: probably most other religion Mike: in Ally: in terms of Mike: just the, the idea of trying to Ally: break the cycle of suffering, Mike: and, trying Ally: to Mike: I don't wanna Ally: say be kind because that's kind of within every religion. But, just making sure that if you're, you're trying to help others Mike: ways Ally: that will help them themselves. Mike: help their own suffering. Ally: Right, right. Yeah, man. And then. Okay.

Gosh, this is crazy. So then you ran New York after, it was, that'd be so hard to have it canceled too. Like you, it's your first Mike: Yeah. Ally: marathon. You never thought you were gonna run a marathon. Then you're like, okay, I've trained Mike: Mm-hmm. Ally: this. Do you remember, like, did you, were you still hopeful it wasn't gonna be canceled? Do you remember kind of that Mike: Yeah, Ally: the days leading up to that? Mike: I, Ally: I, I had, Mike: uh, seen New York Row runners as the year progressed, cancel their, their races. And so I was hopeful. I was like, maybe we'll have something by November that will be able to help us with this, with this, with COVID-19.

Ally: but Mike: when Ally: when they did cancel it, Mike: was, I was not surprised. Ally: right, Mike: fact, I Ally: I was a little. Mike: because I was like, I'm not training as much as I should, and I don't know if I'll be able to do it. so I, I, I will say that I was a little happy that it was delayed, so I Ally: Well, that's good. Mike: of training. Ally: Yeah. Yeah. Well, 'cause I know, you know, I've talked to plenty of people who have had, you know, big races canceled because of COVID and it's just like, man, Mike: Yeah. Ally: for you, you just got an extra year Mike: Yeah.

I Ally: I mean, the benefit was Mike: benefit was that I got to do it the following year. 'cause I know that there are some races they just canceled and they just didn't Ally: Oh yeah. Right. Yeah. Mike: and I Ally: What a time, Mike: I know, like Ally: like for instance, in Boston. Mike: in 2020, if you were a charity runner and you raised money for charity for 2020, you did not get into 2021. Ally: Really? I did not realize that. That's insane. All that money. Mike: and you had to do it all over again for 2021. Ally: Okay. Who? What? Mike: Yeah, Ally: I can't believe I didn't know that.

I feel like Mike: Yeah. It's Ally: so bad. Mike: It's ridiculous. Ally: great that, you know, more money was raised for charity, but it's, that is so hard to raise that kind of money. I have not, I've done, for New York City, I ran for Alex's Lemonade stand, but I wrote a check. I didn't fundraise. I was just like, you know what? This is the cost of doing this. My husband and I give every year. I'm like, we're just use this as one of our gifts. but I know people who are, you know, you're out there getting five and 10 bucks from people Mike: Mm-hmm.

Ally: to $15,000. I mean, it's just crazy. Mike: I had Ally: I had to raise 9,000 for Boston. Me So Mike: it Ally: Mike. Mike: it was not easy. Not easy. Ally: Yeah. Geez. Okay, so New York kind of kicked off your six star journey. Did you, when you ran New York, did you even know what the six stars, like Abbott World Majors were? Mike: I had Ally: I heard something about this. Mike: six star World marathon major thing. I, I like, I think I looked it up and I saw that it was like a bunch of marathons around the world. Ally: Didn't Mike: but I didn't really know what Ally: what it was per se.

All I knew is Mike: I just Ally: wanted. Mike: New York for saying that I could finish Ally: Mm-hmm. Mike: I used to Ally: To work Mike: at the Ally: the Apple Mike: that's on, uh, Ally: Fifth Avenue, 50 Street. So Mike: a Ally: a lot Mike: finishes would come in after the race because it finishes very close to there. And I would always just be in Ally: ofWe. Mike: all these people who would walk in just with the, um, Ally: Yeah, the ponchos. Mike: the poncho on. I, I Ally: I remember we had one Mike: walk Ally: walk down the stairs. Mike: legs gave out.

yeah, it was, I was like, I was like, that's badass right there. but yeah, again, I just wanted to be able to finish it and say that I could. And I liked it, but. It was a massive struggle. you know, I, I, Ally: I. Mike: I don't have as much know, I did not have as much knowledge as I have now when it comes to running with shoes and with, hydration and with fueling. I Ally: I Mike: that Ally: that race Mike: my Ally: feet, Mike: broken, like the, the Ally: outer edges of my heel Mike: or Ally: or not myel, Mike: my, uh, Ally: uh, my arches Mike: were Ally: were so Mike: hurt and they were in, I was in Ally: in Mike: pain that like, I finished and I had to, like, lean up Ally: against Mike: because I couldn't put any pressure on them.

And, Ally: you, Mike: came Ally: to out that Mike: I needed to Ally: to have, Mike: orthotics in my Ally: in my shoes. I had Mike: I had flat Ally: flat Mike: and Ally: and I didn't know. Right. Mike: and Ally: And once I got them, I was totally fine. Wow. But, uh, Mike: you know, Ally: you know, the, Mike: ra I Ally: I remember I was calling my, my Mike: then Ally: girlfriend at the Mike: being Ally: being like, Mike: I, Ally: I'm in so much pain. I dunno if I do this. I Mike: hurt Ally: so bad. Mike: And Ally: And I, my best friend Chris, Mike: who, you Ally: you know, I contribute a lot.

Mike: my growth to, to him because he's a former Marine and he's, he's one of the Ally: The inspirational. Mike: I've I've Ally: I've met Mike: he got on the Ally: the Mike: and he said, don't be a bitch. that, that's been our running line Ally: That's what you need. Yeah. Mike: what I needed. And, and I finished. And, the pictures, I mean, you, if you look on my Instagram, the pictures from that race are like, I thought they were gonna be very cathartic and just like so much emotion, but instead they just look like me sobbing and in pain, Ally: Yeah. Mike: which like is true.

But after finishing that race, I Ally: I was just like. Mike: I can't believe I did this. And I think I wanna do it again. Um, Ally: that that same day. Yeah. Mike: yeah. Ally: That's crazy. Especially with the pain you were in, Mike: yeah. Ally: you get from, so for people who have not done New York, it takes forever to get to the start, and then it also takes forever to get outta the finish. Mike: Oh Ally: So like how did you, did you end up like flagging down a wheelchair and saying, can somebody like wheel me outta here? Or were you literally just hobbled?

Mike: I did go to the med tent and they put ice on my feet, and, and everything, but I, I, Ally: I, I, Mike: up walking out, Ally: yeah. And it takes forever to get outta there. Mike: yeah, that's Ally: It's the 27th mile. It is like the 27th and 28th. I feel like. So long it feels like, yeah. Mike: Like, I did Boston, you just walk down, you make a right, and then you're just out. But with New York, you have to walk all the way around. And it was the 50th anniversary, so it was like so much security because of, of, you know, how prestigious it was for that, that day.

And, And they, the, I don't wanna say that the, the, um, security has gotten a little bit lax over the last couple years, but it was, I remember my, my Ally: My family telling me that they had to go through like three or four security checks because Mike: we bought Ally: seats for them to sit in the bleachers in the finish line. Mike: And so Ally: so you had to go through one security line. Another Mike: in order to make sure you didn't have anything so you Ally: Wow. You had to buy seats. Mike: yeah. I mean, you, they're specifically at the finish line so you can watch people cross Ally: Oh, shoot.

Mike: they're, they're not, well back then they weren't that expensive, but, you know, I thought Ally: I thought it'd be nice them to be there. Mike: since it was my first marathon. Ally: Totally. is that the same at Boston? Do you have to buy seats now? Mike: No. Ally: um, those are, it Mike: it Ally: was Mike: 'cause last year I got two of them for free because of, of my donations with Ally: charity, charity. Mike: But they're Ally: They're not like at the finish line, Mike: far Ally: back. It's really weird. The ones that are at the finish line, I think are only, Mike: designated guests.

Ally: okay. Interesting. Mike: Yeah. Ally: is so interesting. Well, New York as your first marathon is pretty incredible. Were people like telling you, Hey, that's a really hard one to start with. 'cause that's what I think. Mike: No, no one said, no one said anything to me about Ally: You're like, Hey, Mike: I didn't even Ally: think about, you know, I was Mike: just, you know, Ally: gonna New York. Mike: and I didn't even think about the elevation. I didn't even think about all the bridges Ally: Oh my gosh. Yeah. Mike: yeah. Ally: Well, at least you'd been in Central Park. Did you run in the hilly parts of Central Park?

Mike: Oh yeah. Ally: Oh yeah. That's good. Mike: Hill. Harlem Hill in the back is my, my arch nemesis. Ally: Is that on the marathon course? Mike: Thank God. Not anymore. Ally: God, not any. Okay. When it first started it was, but not any. Okay. I feel like I endured that because I remember I didn't know that it was hilly in Central Park. I thought the only hills were the bridges. Mike: Mm-hmm. Ally: And then somebody said to me, oh, just make sure you're ready for Central Park. I was like, what do you mean? And they're like, oh, it's really hilly. I'm glad somebody told me.

'cause I did not realize that, 'cause I'd run in Central Park where it's flat. So I had no idea that there, I mean, it's so big. Like I had no idea there were hills there. So what a race. So you finished New York as your first, like that is really impressive. And it got, you got to do it on the 50th anniversary. Mike: Yeah. Ally: That's pretty special. It's like, okay, how do you top that? Well, tell us the story. Mike: Well, my uncle's wife passed away, say over the summer of 2021. And Ally: So we were trying to find some way to honor her and her.

My uncle, Mike: After they Ally: they retired, they moved to Florida Mike: they, Ally: and they worked at that Disney room. Mike: And Ally: so Mike: my Ally: my wife, Mike: came up with the idea, you know, Ally: you know, why don't you, Mike: why Ally: why don't you run the, Mike: marathon for them? And I was like, Ally: okay, great. Mike: when is Ally: It was January of, Mike: of, uh, Ally: 20, 22 months after two. Mike: York. Ally: I ran that, right? I hated it. Mike: I like, I think Ally: think that was probably the Mike: one Ally: marathon that I did not like.

Mike: And it's, Ally: whenever I tell, Mike: that, they're like, how, what do you mean? It was Disney? and Ally: and Mike: it Ally: it was awesome running through Mike: King and running Ally: underneath Ciella Castle, but Mike: couple things. One, they let people into the Ally: the Mike: like your, the Spectator, they let them into the park at like six o'clock in the morning. And so I got to see my wife, which was awesome, but then Ally: Them out Mike: they kicked them out and Ally: and then Mike: you Ally: don't get a ticket. Mike: get in. if you Ally: Run the race, Mike: I, for the Ally: the amount of money.

Mike: I just don't understand that. Ally: But then 75, Mike: even, Ally: probably like 85% of the race was on Mike: highways 'cause you're Ally: You're running in between the parks Mike: And Ally: because it was like COVID time. Mike: there're Ally: They're supposed to have characters along the way. There were characters, but there weren't like Mike: That Ally: that many, or the ones that they had were not Mike: I, I don't important, I Ally: like they were obscure characters. I could, I could totally picture what you're saying Mike: and I got to mile 20 and, I accidentally ended my run. so that made me mad.

And then I started to see like out and Ally: back Mike: going on Ally: on the highway Mike: then Ally: and coming back and I was like, I have to do that too. Mike: I Ally: I don't wanna do this. Mike: And so I was like, I Ally: My Mike: I was like talking to my wife, I was like, I hate this so much. I don't want to do Ally: do this. I think I just wanna leave. But I finished it for my, my dad. Mike: and you Ally: you know, Mike: it, to Ally: to this day it was my slowest marathon. But, Mike: ' cause I walked a lot.

Ally: and this, and right after New York, actually, I Mike: applied to the Ally: to the lottery Mike: Berlin. Ally: just for the heck of it. I was like, I, I've never traveled outside of the country, Mike: I've Ally: I've never been to Europe. I've never done anything like that. So I was like, Mike: I'm Ally: I'm not gonna get in. There's probably so many people. Mike: apply and, and whatever. I Ally: I got an email Mike: I think it was in December at like four or Ally: five in the morning Mike: And I Ally: and I remember Mike: just Ally: said, rolling over, checking my phone, Mike: and seeing that, and Ally: and I jumped out of bed and I yelled, Mike: to my wife.

She's like, what? Ally: what, Mike: What Ally: what happened? I said, I just got into the Berlin Marathon, Mike: so we Ally: we are going to Europe next year. Mike: And she was Ally: Saying Mike: what? So Ally: that was actually the moment that kicked off my Mike: my six Ally: next. Mike: 'cause I was like, Ally: New Mike: New York was Ally: was great. Mike: was Ally: It was like kind of my intro into marathon. I, you know Mike: I was like, you know what? Ally: what Berlin is gonna be the one Mike: everything. And, and I Ally: I started to really do a lot of research with running.

I started to Mike: the, the different Ally: acknowledge these Mike: use, the different Ally: types of feeling, Mike: you Ally: you know, how to balance out your diet during the Mike: a Ally: marathon, you Mike: a wall. Ally: and Mike: And, um, finding the Ally: the shoes. Really, Mike: for me and it Ally: it was Mike: a Ally: a lot of training. Mike: then I decided also that, reason Ally: I was also gonna run Chicago because why not, Mike: why Ally: not? And it was two after. Mike: after Berlin. Ally: Oh my god. Yeah. You crazy people Mike: in, Ally: I got. Mike: into that with a charity.

And Ally: And so Mike: I, I Ally: I did that and then at the same time Mike: I had Ally: I qualified in 2024 Mike: for the New Ally: New York City, Mike: in 2022. Ally: marathoning, Chicago, Berlin, New York. Mike: and so that Ally: that took up all of my training Mike: the year. Ally: and it was, wait, okay, so you did all of those back to back to back Mike: yeah. Ally: in 22 then it would've been, or is that Yeah. Mike: I was also supposed to run Philly, which was a week after New York. Ally: Uhhuh. Mike: I finished New York, I was like, I'm gonna defer.

I'm good. I, Ally: I think that's a smart choice, Mike. Way to go. Mike: yeah. Um, but it Ally: It was, it was great. Mike: Berlin, I, I had, I had set out with a goal, like, 'cause I finished New York 4 27. I was like, you know what? I, I want to break four Ally: Ground Mike: I, I think I can do it if I train Ally: train. Properly? Mike: I don't like, we'll see what happens. Berlin, so mad about this. I finished in four hours flat. Ally: No, Mike: I was so Ally: like 0, 0, 0. Zero, zero. Yep. Mike: It was like four hours and like seven.

It was literally four hours and like seven milliseconds. Ally: Oh my gosh, that's really annoying. I would be pissed too. I'm sorry. Mike: mad. I was like, are you kidding me? And then I, I passed out when I finished Berlin, Ally: Oh, Mike: it was just, it was, I was so dehydrated because I, didn't understand the, the proper, fueling during a marathon. And, it was fine. I think out of all the world marathon ages, Berlin's probably my least favorite because it just felt like the spectators felt forced to be there. They weren't like the energy that you get at New, I mean, maybe I, it is because New York is my first one, but like the Ally: I mean, Mike: like, is like, like no other marathon.

Like it was, it's crazy. And Berlin I think was a little bit more, was relaxed. Ally: I picture Germany and like German culture, like no offense to Germans. I mean, clearly my last name is Brettnacher, so it's like, but just the stoicism of Germans and the more serious and like, like I just, that's what I kind of picture. When you describe that and it's like just not nearly the same thing as Mike: Yeah, that, Ally: that's, that's what I, Mike: too. and luckily we made a trip out of it. So we spent like, four or five days in Paris and then we went, then we went back home.

Ally: Chicago Mike: was a struggle. I ended up with some ankle problems at like mile 20 and had to walk, run the rest of it. But I finished, I met a Ally: met Mike: great Ally: great guy while I was running Mike: with named, Ally: Mario and Mike: I Ally: I remember seeing him and I was like, that man has incredible running. Mike: I Ally: I ran up next to him. I said, mind if I pace Mike: And we just like chatted the whole Ally: The whole time we were running, our goal was for both of us. Mike: four Ally: Four. Mike: I Ally: I don't think either of us did, Mike: but Ally: but it was great.

Mike: know, be able to just like an instant connection with some random person that you're riding next to. You're both struggling, you're both doing this thing that is really difficult. and, and you're both having a good Ally: A good. Mike: And then New York in 2022 was, was just like awful because it was. Ally: Like 80 degrees. Oh, that's right. Oh yeah. Mike: They Ally: Ran outta cup outta water. Mm. Mike: And I Ally: I decided that Mike: race, that was Ally: that was probably Mike: my only race so far where I was like, I'm not going to try to pr I'm not going to try to do anything special.

I'm gonna have fun. So I was like pictures of people. I was dancing with people. It was, it was a lot of fun. 'cause I'm usually, I get pretty Ally: serious. Mike: my marathons 'cause Ally: Yeah. Mike: get in the zone. But that one, Ally: when I decided to take, Mike: 'cause I was like, Ally: like I don't wanna the Mike: in the hospital. I'm good. Ally: I don't wanna pass out at the end. I think that's fair. Mike: Yeah, Ally: Yeah. Did they take you to the hospital in Germany or did they just get you in the med tent and you were fine. Mike: Put me in the med tent and then, like 15 minutes later, like, Ally: Okay, good.

Go. Geez, Mike, your health, this is like crazy. Good. . Mike: Chicago was awesome. Ally: I felt like the Of Chicago. Mike: much like New Ally: Yeah. Yeah. Chicago, I've done the most out of all the marathons I've done because we're about three hours south in Indianapolis. Of Chicago, so it's very accessible for us. I did it before there was a lottery. I think the last time I did it was in 2014 and that was a lottery. And I got in somehow. I don't know, but ever since then, no dice. So maybe someday again, but yeah, so Chicago. Okay, so what order? So it was Chicago, Berlin, New York.

Okay. Chicago, Berlin, New York, did you work with a coach or anything like that at this point? Do you work with a coach now? No, Mike: No, I, Ally: I. Mike: um, I used an app. I don't remember what, I think it was the run with How app, of worked but didn't. Now I use Runa and Ally: Okay. Mike: listen, Runa, if you wanna Ally: Wanna sponsor Mike: I've, I've broken all my prs with you Ally: guys? Mike: it for four Ally: Marathon. Mike: phenomenal, that would, I cannot like how awesome run is. And I used it before it got really big. Like I used it like three years ago when it first started out.

And it Ally: Interesting. Mike: it, it was awesome. Ally: Are they based in New York? Mike: no, Ally: No, they're based in London. Okay, interesting. Mike: Yeah. it, they just got bought by Strava actually. Ally: Oh, I missed that. Interesting. Yeah, my whole, my previous life I'll say was in technology. It was in software. So That's interesting. that makes a lot of sense when you just think about how AI's gonna play into a lot of that with all the data that it has on you and how it could, you know, I still think for me personally, having a, having a person to hold me accountable helps.

But you also, you have a community to hold you accountable. Um, and certainly your own motivation, so. Okay. That's cool. That's, that's a heck of a testament. I think Runa should sponsor you. So for what that's worth, which is nothing really, but you know, you gotta, you gotta put it out there, otherwise it'll never happen. So yeah. Maybe I could get them to sponsor this podcast. That would be cool. This episode is brought to you by runner. Just kidding. Wouldn't that be cool? If anyone knows anyone? This episode is brought to you by my very own small business athlete. Bouquets, gifts for runners. If you wanna celebrate the runner in your life, look no further than athlete bouquets.com.

You can use Code Podcast for 10% off your order. Athlete bouquets.com back to the show. So yeah. Maybe I could get them to sponsor this podcast. That would be cool. so out. Okay, so then it was, that was 22. Mike: Mm-hmm. Ally: Did you run marathons in 2023? Yeah, I Mike: Yeah, I Ally: did. Mike: in 23, and then I did New York again. London was great. I, I've ran Ally: ran into ankle issues, Mike: but Ally: but that was primarily Mike: it had just rained and the, it was pretty slippery the, on the Ally: the road Mike: And Ally: and Mike: in London, it's Ally: different from the marathon Mike: that they don't give you cups.

They give you Ally: bottles of, Mike: And Ally: and so people Mike: drink the Ally: the bottles Mike: or drink some Ally: some Mike: and then throw them on the ground. And so the ground is just covered in bottles. and you'll, I mean, if you read Ally: about, Mike: run the London Marathon, there are so many people who will step on one and slip and roll their ankle or break their ankle and Ally: and they'll have to, Mike: it quits. But, Ally: I think it was like Mike: 13. My, I, I like Ally: landed on Mike: and my, my ankle went to the Ally: side.

And so I was like, okay, we're gonna, we're gonna come down. Mike: but Ally: But the crowds were incredible. I, I still can't believe that there was so many people out after just three. Mike: So I was, Ally: blown away by that. And Mike: it was, it was Ally: it was a really nice, like cenic route. So you Mike: to run like over Ally: on the Tower bridge, you gotta see Mike: uh, Ally: obviously Big Bend the Eye Mike: by, Ally: walking at Palace. Mike: And it, it was, it Ally: It was, it was really Mike: It was really cool. I really Ally: like Mike: we were Ally: you were in London for about a week.

Mike: and, uh, you know, got Ally: Got experience it while we were there. Then Mike: then, I, I Ally: I kind of tried to make it, it's like my, my habit of Mike: doing New Ally: York every year. Mike: So, Ally: say it's kind of been a streak. So now you kind of have to, Mike: yeah. my Ally: my goal is Mike: up to, if you run 15 of them, uh, then you Ally: you don't have to follow. Mike: anymore. You just get in. Ally: That was gonna be my next question 'cause I know Chicago, I think it's like 10 Mike: Yeah. Ally: something like that.

Yeah. Yeah. Wow. 15. So, I mean, you're on your way. I'm Mike: I'm like a third of the Ally: the, Mike: almost. Ally: that's wild. And for New York, this is, I guess aside, let's go. But how do you get to the start? Are you a bus? Are you a ferry? Have you done both? Mike: No, I get a Ally: No, I or you? Oh, Mike: so the first year we got a hotel in Staten Island, and then after that, I guess everybody else figured out you could do that. So they've always been sold out. So what we do is we stay Ally: outside new.

Mike: and Ally: in the past, what we've done, Mike: Uber to the start line. It won't be, it's not Ally: not that much, but Mike: but what we Ally: he found now is it's. Mike: easier for us to drive to the starting line area, drop me off, and then my wife will, will drive back and Ally: And take the train into Mike: and go do Ally: whatever she wants to do. Mike: to the finish line. Ally: Wow. Okay. Yeah, I, mine was a nightmare. We stayed in Long Island City in a hotel, first hotel. First hotel we had booked. I'm like getting ready to get on the airplane with my friend and I'm reading the reviews of this hotel, Mike, and the first review that was like a month ago was like bedbugs.

Yeah. Which I'm like, I'm not from New York City, so I, you know, I think that's somewhat normal. I don't know, but it, that's really gross. And I said, I'm not staying there the night before a marathon. Like, what if we get bedbugs? Mike: absolutely not. Ally: yeah. Thankfully my friend Ashley, like we, she is like the problem solver and she crushed it. She like called, she was on the phone with somebody for hours and we got a different hotel. Anyway, but I say this because it was just like we had to take, I think we walked to the train, took a train to the bus, took the bus to the start and it was the whole thing to get there.

Took me longer than it took me to, to run. which is crazy to think about. So that's nice that you at least know how to do it, to make that a much easier process. 'cause it's a lot. Mike: I, I didn't wanna have to deal with all that, and I, I, I, when I volunteer now, my thing that I do is I, I hand out bibs. the, uh, at the expo for everybody. I always see at the bottom of the bib, it tells them like what their, what mode of transportation is. Ally: Yeah. Mike: I see the times and I'm Ally: I'm like, Mike: I'm Ally: I'm not a 40 person, Mike: I'm Ally: I'm not gonna be ready.

Mike: on a bus at five o'clock in the morning, Ally: Yeah, Mike: and if I am, I'm gonna be so, so cranky. Ally: yeah, yeah. It was rough. It was rough. And then you sit on Staten Island for hours. Mike: Yeah. That's what I've Ally: So I remember like I packed myself a peanut butter and banana sandwich. I had magazines, which I did not read, but somebody told me to bring some. So I was like, okay, if I'm just gonna be sitting here. But yeah, it was, it was all part of the experience though, and it was a really cool experience. London, you mentioned the plastic bottles.

I also heard that in Berlin they have plastic cups. Is that true Mike: Um, Ally: you remember? I think when Mike: think when I did it, it, Ally: I did it, Mike: may have been paper cups. I, I honestly don't remember. I. Ally: somebody told me, maybe it was last year, I don't know, the year, all blurred together now, but somebody told me and that stuck with me. 'cause I was like, how would I drink? Like you go from like. Always having paper cups that you fold and drink. It's like, how the heck would I drink out of a plastic cup and then not trip over 'em.

To your point, I have not heard that about London until you just told me. So that's Mike: I had a, I, I, I Ally: I talked to. Mike: one of my followers last week who ran, bought, uh, London, and he told me about how he saw people go down and he's, he's actually a, um, a physician, so he was like, he was dying himself because it was so hot, but he was also checking on people to make sure they were okay at the same time. Ally: Yeah, that'd be hard to turn that off when you're running through strangers who might need help. Mike: yeah. Ally: And how was training, 'cause that, let's see, that was your first spring marathon, right?

At that point. Mike: Yeah. Ally: So how was training in the winter for you? Mike: Not great. I do, I I've discovered that training for spring marathons is a lot of treadmill running. Ally: Yeah. Yeah. I was gonna say with, with your, how do you say it? Rays or Rays or Mike: Rain Ally: rays. Rays. I've heard that that can, that some people deal with that while they're training for marathons, because I've actually thought I've had it before, but anyway. Yeah. Well, how, what's your furthest run on a treadmill? Mike: I don't know if I've done 20 miles, but I, I think I've done at least 15.

Ally: Yeah. That's so much. How do you do that? I mean, I've done pretty far, but Mike: Yeah. It's, it's a lot of, a lot of music. luckily now I have a, a Peloton tread, Ally: mm-hmm. Mike: what I'll do a lot is I'll stack a bunch of classes on top of each other and, and, and do things like that. And. I don't really pay attention to them because I'm listening to my music. But it's nice to have like something I could look at potentially to kind of get Ally: Yeah, you don't watch Netflix because that's what I do. I watch movies. Mike: I've done it sometimes.

Ally: sometimes. Mike: I don't think my mind is able to focus. Is, is Ally: Okay. That's fair. That's fair. Yeah. And then, oh yeah, we have to talk. I'm glad you mentioned Peloton, 'cause we do need to talk about that as well, Mike: Absolutely. Ally: Um, but let's finish the six star journey while we're there. Mike: Mm-hmm. Ally: So London 23, did you run And then New York in 23. What else? In 23? Any other races? Mike: Um, Ally: Um, I Mike: a bunch of New York City, uh, this is the New York Row runner races. I think I did in 23. Did I do the Brooklyn half?

I did not because I, for, I missed signing up for it. think I did the united half. I did, the Queen's 10 KI did a bunch of four milers that they had. stuff like that. Ally: now, if somebody is interested in doing. A race in New York, outside of the, the marathon, which race has been a favorite for you? Mike: I would say Ally: the race Mike: that they do in Central Park Ally: in Mike: are, uh, Ally: a lot, Mike: have the same exact course, Ally: but the energy is different. Mike: on the race that you Ally: Mm-hmm. Like Mike: there's, Ally: um, the pride run that they do, Mike: in June, and Ally: and then there's also Mike: it's around the same time they do an Ally: Achilles, Mike: for the Ally: the Achilles Foundation Mike: those Ally: mm-hmm.

Individuals that are, are Mike: runners that Ally: that have, Mike: some sort of disability and to see, Ally: uh, so many of those runners, they are, Mike: you Ally: you know, persevering, pushing through, there's, they're Mike: they're Ally: running over hills. You see me. Mike: on, uh, hand cycles, you know, Ally: Line runners, things like that, really pushing to get to that finish line. And there's a medal in the end, which is great. I, I like those two. The queen's 10 K is really nice because it's flat. Mike: Only Ally: Only thing Mike: that's Ally: not great about it is that there's no Mike: covering.

Ally: So you, Mike: it gets really hot. Ally: I, I don't wanna say the Brooklyn half because it is relatively Mike: because you, you, you run around Ally: around Central Mike: and then I want to Ally: Park, Mike: the last six-ish miles, it's just straight Ally: straight down Toney Island on a highway. Mike: there's, there Ally: Oh, there's there people there, Mike: and crowds, but it's, there's no scenery or anything like that. Ally: okay. Mike: United Half is cool because you run Ally: Right over Mike: Bridge. This year was the Brooklyn Bridge, and you run through Central Ally: Central Mike: but Ally: But Mike: there's a Ally: there's a good like Mike: miles, no, not even, probably five or six that are just on the FDR highway.

And Ally: Okay. Mike: they Ally: They don't allow crowds there. Mike: there's nobody, Ally: uh, and square. Pretty cool. Mike: it's, it's just packed full of people. And then you finish in Central Park. actually my, Ally: My, my Mike: race is Ally: is Mike: the Ally: Abbo. Mike: 5K dash of the finish, which is the day before the New York City Marathon. Ally: Oh, Mike: you Ally: you start at the Mike: building, you Ally: you run up to Mike: sixth Ally: Avenue Mike: the Ally: Central. Mike: and then Ally: And Mike: you, Ally: um, Mike: you cross the New Ally: the New York City Marathon.

Mike: line. So they have the whole thing set up. So you see. like the finish time, Ally: Yeah. Everything. Mike: up there, you see the bleachers, you see all the flags. It's really, really cool. and Ally: It's like, especially you don't run New City Marathon Mike: you that Ally: feeling, right? Mike: to the end of like, you're, you're crossing it. Ally: Yeah. That's really cool. Are any of these, are they hard to get into? I feel like. The United half and the Brooklyn half have become so popular as running has just continued to become more popular. Are they like you have to sign up the day it opens?

Is it a lottery? How Mike: So Ally: Both of them have, Mike: but there's, there's different ways you can get in. So you can't just like forthright sign up for it. Now, the only people who can are, who like meet a couple different criteria. So obviously you can qualify, but the United half, they, if you live in New York City or in the New York, around the New York area, they have, races in each borough. Ally: and if you do Mike: four of them. then you get Ally: get entry into the next, Mike: race. They Ally: they Mike: have a Ally: a virtual one. Mike: where if you do that, then you get entry into, into the next year.

Ally: Okay. Mike: Brooklyn's easier for Ally: for people Mike: not from New York because it's based off of six, , Ally: on virtual races, Mike: So if you, I Ally: so I think they do be during the year, Mike: six of Ally: them. Mike: then you get entry into the following Ally: Oh, that's interesting. Okay. So like for somebody like me, that would be a lot more doable. Yeah, you just have to just do it. Mike: the Strava and then it just counts it. Ally: Okay, well that's neat. Okay. Yeah, because I love the idea of doing one of those, but then I just, it from the outside looking in, it just looks so hard to get in anymore to anything really.

Mike: I mean, the easiest way for the United Half is just do the virtual, Ally: Yeah. Yeah. Mike: But Ally: But they do sell, Mike: quickly now. it's a nightmare. New York Row runners, it needs to fix or do something with their races because, it, they, Ally: They go on on sale. Mike: at like noon on the day that they go on sale, and then they're all pretty much sold out by like 4:00 PM and it's just like ridiculous how quickly they sell out. And the only way to really into them without having to worry about Ally: About it Mike: is Ally: to pay for an Mike: for an Ally: upgraded membership unless you Mike: register Ally: earlier.

Right. Mike: is what I have, because I missed Ally: All of the races for, Mike: April, Ally: may. Mike: and June, because they sold out, which makes me mad because now I have to do all the races in the summer. Ally: Right. Ugh. Yeah. That's wild. It's so good for the sport that people want to do it, but it's also just kind of infuriating because you're like, I, I wanna do it. Mike: exactly. Ally: Yeah. so did you say you did London for charity? Yes. Mike: Yes. Ally: Okay. Mike: I've done Ally: Chicago. Mike: Boston, London and Tokyo with charities, Ally: Wow. Good for you.

That's incredible. So which year, so London, New York in 23 and then Did you do Tokyo and Boston this year? Mike: 24. Ally: 24. Mike: Yeah. Ally: yeah, I was like, wait, what is today? yeah, it's 2025. okay, so you did both of those last year and how are those experiences? Mike: Tokyo was incredible. I, I've always wanted to go to Tokyo, and so when I got in with my charity, I like freaked out because I just like. I just think about the fact that running has taken me all over the world and Ally: I just don't know how Mike: I Ally: I would've been able to travel to these places Mike: if Ally: if I had not been running Mike: and Ally: and so Mike: when we got Ally: got there.

It was, Mike: like a kid in the candy store, like it was Tokyo Ally: is Mike: by Ally: far my favorite Mike: the world. Like I always joke with people, like, I would move there in a heartbeat if given the Ally: option. Mike: and the Ally: Tokyo Marathon was Mike: fantastic. I, the, you always hear about people saying that the crowds are quieter and, and not as like, Ally: Loud Mike: what you would get from Ally: like Mike: and Chicago, Ally: but Mike: What Ally: what they lack in that per se, which it's still loud, Mike: but what Ally: what they lack in that is Mike: more Ally: more of, Mike: it Ally: it feels like a genuine Mike: want to Ally: to be there.

Mike: they want you to succeed. Ally: Even the volunteers are like, Mike: for you. Like they'll Ally: they'll be off Mike: in Ally: in the corner Mike: just clapping, like, Ally: like cheering on Mike: sure that you're okay. Um, it was Ally: was perfect weather and that was actually first Mike: that I broke four hours. I got officially, it was Ally: it was, Mike: 48 actually. My, Ally: yeah, I was looking Mike: my watch says 3 43, so I went with that. But, was, it was a really, really tremendous moment for me because I remember crossing the finish line Ally: and I've never had before Mike: I burst into tears, I just started sobbing this runner Ally: Runner.

Mike: to me and just gave me a big hug. And it was, it was, it was great. and I Ally: I had, I had so much fun doing it. Mike: It was, was Ally: Beautiful. Mike: You know, and all Ally: All my races, all Mike: my Ally: marathon. Mike: it a, a goal to, find my Ally: My, Mike: or wherever Ally: she Mike: We call each other, we find out what the logistics are of what she's by, where I can look for her. Um, and I always blow her a kiss. And so I was, I was happy that I was able to see her with this.

'cause she, she Ally: wasn't Mike: no Ally: like bleachers or, Mike: line area, like I had to look for her. and Ally: so Mike: that Ally: was, Mike: was Ally: was Mike: And we were there for like, Ally: almost, Mike: weeks. Ally: does she wear something special Mike: Um, Ally: have a special sign? No. Mike: it, we, we were trying to figure out what she's gonna wear like in the future. Ally: Right. It's like neon. I don't know what's like the most, Mike: bright. Ally: yeah. Mike: bright Ally: Yeah. Mike: her. in 2023. I missed her 'cause I couldn't find her in the bleachers. And so she has a video of me running and I'm like, this the whole time, Ally: Like, where are you?

You should just be like blowing. You should just be like blowing kisses everywhere. Like, I don't know where you are, but like Mike: That's Ally: maybe you could see this. Yeah. I mean, but in that moment you're like, where are you? I am, where am I? Like that's a tough Yeah, yeah, Mike: is life? Ally: yeah, exactly. Mike: but yeah, Tokyo, I Ally: I think Tokyo, Mike: really far up there as one of my favorite marathons. and then I Ally: I did Boston Mike: in Ally: in April. Month later, Mike: Boston was, was great. Ally: people were in Mike: The course was deadly. And, you know, those, those Ally: Newton.

Mike: are, are Ally: No joke. I remember Mike: telling Ally: myself. Mike: run up Heartbreak Hill and you're, you know, you're gonna be really proud of yourself. And I didn't even know that I was on Heartbreak Hill until I saw the sign that says, you crested Heartbreak Hill. And I was like, oh, I walked it. Ally: But Mike: crossing Ally: that finish line, Mike: like Ally: like even to this day, like I don't feel like it was real. Mike: Like Ally: Like I have my medal somewhere, Mike: In this room. Ally: but I just like, Mike: I don't Ally: I don't know. It, it Mike: feels like Ally: like it didn't happen Mike: a sense.

and I, and, you know, I remember crying and just being really, really proud of, of the fact that I was Ally: I was able to do this and it was kind of sad Mike: because, you know, you Ally: like I worked Mike: for Ally: right Mike: to get to this and you know, Ally: now that I've, now that I accomplished it. Mike: like, what do I do now? Like, Ally: Yes. Yeah, that's hard. Mike: Like, do I Ally: Try Mike: a marathon in Ally: to run a marathon. Mike: state in the country? Do I, I don't know. Do I try to run one in every continent?

And, Ally: Yeah. Right. Totally. Mike: and, you know, I, I decided that I was just, I'm gonna do it again. Ally: Oh, Mike: yeah. So, you know, Ally: know, I'd already done New York. Mike: New York, I already had one star again. Ally: Yeah. Mike: and so I Ally: I did Tokyo and Boston. Mike: year. So that's three Ally: That's why I got confused. Okay. Because I was like, didn't you do it this year? But you did it again, Mike Tokyo. Mike: wasn't gonna do Tokyo. I Ally: I wasn't, Mike: Tokyo, but then I Ally: I got, Mike: from them over the summer, my charity, and they were like, we're looking forward to your application.

I was like, well, I, Ally: I, I, Mike: I Ally: I asked my wife Mike: how do you think I should do it? She was like, you know, I wouldn't say Ally: say you, Mike: in, Ally: because before Mike: when we went Ally: last Mike: she was like, I don't really want to go to Tokyo. Like, I don't have any inkling to, and then we got there and after like the first day, she was like, I love it here. It's Ally: Yeah. Mike: and then I Ally: I got in Mike: and, you know, I was really happy with that. And then Ally: Boston. Mike: Boston was nothing.

I wasn't gonna run Boston, but I got offered to run Boston with shocks. so I, I Ally: I found out while I was in Tokyo. Mike: like Ally: Oh my gosh. Mike: a Ally: A month before the marathon Mike: out Ally: found out that I was gonna do it. Mike: and so that was, that was awesome. And then I have New York and Chicago at the end of the year. Ally: Wow. Mike: Um, so that'll be four stars. Ally: Geez. And that leaves Berlin and Chica or in London, sorry. Yeah. so, okay. I forget, I like have to try to remember when all the windows are open for like, registering or like putting your name in the hat.

' have you already applied? Okay. Mike: just passed. Ally: Okay. Mike: Berlin is at the, I think it's in like September, October. Ally: Okay. Because it's around the time of the race ish. Okay. It's hard. I can't keep track and I, I don't even remember. There's some, I think I put in for London. Maybe I forget. Like I literally, sometimes on a whim I'll just be like, I should just see and then, you know, it's a good excuse if you get in and be like, I need to go now. 'cause it's really hard to get in. that's what my brother-in-law did last year. He got into London and Berlin.

So they went, did both, which is, or no, they, oh no, he only did London and Boston I think because, yeah. Anyway, I would love to do them all. I would love to, we'll see, I've got Chicago and New York. I would love to qualify for Boston. I am almost 40. So that's, I'm kinda like waiting for that so that I can just get a little bit more leeway. But I'm also afraid that if I wait too long, they're just gonna keep making it harder. Mike: the times Ally: It's like, I don't know. So I just tell people I'm chasing my best, you know? And that gets me to Boston.

That's great 'cause that's what I would love to do. But if not, then hopefully I still achieve the best that I possibly can. Mike: Yep. Ally: And you've also said that you are chasing a sub three hour marathon, which is Mike: Um, Ally: to think that you could even like backtrack a few years, you were like, I hope I can run for 20 minutes on a treadmill. And now you're like, Hmm, I could perhaps do under three hours. Mike: Yeah, it was, I never Ally: thought. Mike: hours of sub three would, would ever be possible for me. It sub four was just like something that always was outta reach.

It was like there, but just like of my graphs just a little bit. And then, so last year when I did Tokyo was 3 48. And then I did New York last year and I did three 11. Ally: Which is just nuts. That is nuts. In New York, Mike: know what Ally: what happened? Like Mike: to mile 17 and I felt really good. And I have two running playlists. One is just, it literally, it's called running music and shit. then the other one is called Fast as Fuck Boy. And so I got to mile 17 and I, I texted my Ally: my wife, I said Mike: other running playlists Ally: coming Mike: now.

And I like. Those last, what, nine Ally: miles Mike: I just like went for it. And my training at Runa told me you'll finish the Ally: marathon. Mike: hours, in 25 minutes. I beat that by 14 Ally: Yeah. Mike: And I just like, don't, like there's the picture of me crossing the finish line. I was screaming I, I was like, yes. but after that I was like, you know, maybe I could break three hours. My, me and my, me and my best friend Chris, are making it a goal to try to break three hours this year. And, we are a little bit competitive. I, he had run the, the Warsaw Marathon either a week before or two weeks before the New York City Marathon, and he hit three.

20 something. We, Ally: Okay. Mike: to break three 30 and he hit three under three 30. And I was like, oh crap, now I have to do that. And so I hit three Ally: 11. Mike: He just Ally: Just ran the Barcelona Marathon. Mike: and hit 3 0 8. Ally: Ooh. Look at you guys going back and forth. Yeah. Mike: now I had to figure out what's going on with that because I did Tokyo and I did Boston this year and I finished in 3 13, 3 14. So five Ally: months now. Mike: four Ally: Oh yeah. Plenty of time. Mike: to get this. and, and Ally: I Mike: goal was either either Ally: Chicago.

Mike: New York to break the three hour Ally: Okay. Mike: I, Ally: Chicago, obviously. Mike: easier 'cause it's Ally: Mm-hmm. Mike: it would mean a lot more to me if it was New York just because, you know, my first marathon, it would be my fifth time running it. Ally: Yeah. And Mike: that is Ally: is the one Mike: like, surprisingly, I feel Ally: feel Mike: have down because I've Ally: I've been able to Mike: it down so Ally: so much in my mind, Mike: and understand like each Ally: portion. Mm-hmm. Mike: well, so that I Ally: I don't. Mike: you know, really, surprised by any portion of it.

Ally: Right. Yeah, that's helpful. Mike: a sub three marathon just never in my mind seemed possible. And then last year happened and I was like, oh, maybe this is, Ally: Yeah. And to think you like weren't an athlete growing up? Mike: no, no Ally: no one in my family. Mike: mean, Ally: I mean, my brother, Mike: golf, but like, no Ally: no one in my family. Mike: doesn't I, me and my grandma bowled and she was in the hall of fame for getting a 300. But that was like, that Ally: Wow. Mike: That Ally: That's pretty cool. Mike: Oh Ally: Oh yeah. That's so cool.

Mike: My grandma's a badass. Um, but like I played, I played little League soccer for a season and I played little league baseball. and as my mom likes to say, when I was in outfield and I would play with the grass, you Ally: Mm. Mike: it was like I never did track and field. I never ran. and somehow this is like, this has happened. Ally: It's just amazing. I wanna talk to you a little bit about the rundown. Mike: Mm-hmm. Ally: you're starting in talking to everyday runners and just chatting. I loved what you put together after Tokyo of like just chatting with a few people, asking the same questions, putting it all together.

Like it was really cool. And so what made you do it? it was really Mike: those first Ally: ing Mike: you know, Ally: you know, I, Mike: I Ally: I just thought about, Mike: Just Ally: talking to runners of all backgrounds Mike: and just seeing what Ally: and their experiences. Mike: 'cause I, Ally: I wasn't really blown by, by the fact that like, Mike: think I did six people and Ally: every single one of them had different Mike: I had people that DN fd, I had people that did Ally: really well, I people struggle. Mike: people who Ally: who ran their first marathon, first international marathon and being able to hear their stories and Mike: you know, understanding Ally: their own grit and their perseverance.

Mm-hmm. Inspiring to me. Mike: And, I feel Ally: I feel like we are, Mike: the Ally: the running community as a whole Mike: really Ally: likes to put a voice Mike: emphasis on people that Ally: letter, like Mike: Elites or Ally: Sure. Mike: elites or Ally: Really fast. Mike: and Ally: and not those individuals that are just like the Mike: runner, the average Ally: person likes to place up their, Mike: and go Ally: go out there Mike: and Ally: and pound the pavement are the trails and, Mike: and Ally: have fun. Mike: know, I, I Ally: Mm-hmm. Mike: a Ally: Lot of the people that we Mike: we see that are, you know, the, the big voices in the running community are the people who, I don't, I don't think that it's Ally: necessarily Mike: fun for them anymore.

I think it's just become more of a, a job and more of a have to, rather than a want to. being able to talk to people who want to do this Ally: and Mike: aren't Ally: necessarily chasing Mike: big Ally: extravagant goals. So just like, you know, I. Mike: go out there and have fun. I wanna push myself. it is something that I think my Ally: goal is to inspire other runners or other people who are thinking into running, yeah, Mike: you know, I wanna Ally: run, Mike: but I. Ally: I can't run a Mike: minute mile. I can barely run a 15 minute Ally: right?

Mike: people are gonna judge me and they're not gonna think that I'm a runner and I'm just gonna feel like a failure. Um, and, and I think hearing the Ally: The stories, the people that are in their shoes or have gone Mike: they're going through Ally: through what they're going through in the beginning. Mike: and Ally: And that's one thing that I always to avoid social media profiles, is Mike: I Ally: I always go back to where I started from because those people that are at day zero, I know what Mike: like Ally: and it was a like, people like to think Mike: that Ally: runners like what They the Mike: the get Ally: go right.

Mike: to say that like, I hated it, but I knew I needed to stick it out in order to get to where I wanted to be. and so that's really what I wanted, do with this. And, and, Ally: Um, Mike: I, I'm Ally: I'm really excited. I've got a couple Mike: interviews I've Ally: I've already done that I edit. Mike: I Ally: I just have to stop being lazy. Mike: And Ally: it's hard. It's editing is hard work Mike: yeah. And Ally: and I've got a couple people. Mike: reach out to me saying that they wanted to do one as well. Ally: Yeah. Yeah. That's so great.

I relate to it a ton. Obviously, given what I have been doing the last couple years. I remember just thinking like when I would drive around, just like seeing people running that, I didn't know. And I'm just like, I wonder why they run. I wonder if they're just like running their normal four mile loop that they do every day, or if they like just run for a few minutes if they, you know, just like, are they training for something or do they just run around? I don't know. And so just kind of the curiosity of like, what are all these people doing? And you can, you know, like when you're in New York and there's 50,000 people and you're looking around and you're like.

How did all these people get here? Like what did that one person like have to do to get to New York or to get the six stars? I mean, it's just really interesting to hear people's stories 'cause we're all so different, even though we all share a love of something that's the same. So yeah, I think it's really cool that you're starting to do that and yeah, I can't wait to follow along. Yeah. I appreciate that. Mm-hmm. And then, okay, one more thing before I ask you the end of podcast questions is Mike: Yeah. Ally: of the things that drew me to you was that you have in your profile the anti Matt Choi, who, if people do not know who that is, maybe you should just briefly mention who he is and then why you say that.

Mike: Yeah. So Matt Ally: Yeah. So Matt Mike: influencer. he's become rather big on the, in the running community over the last couple years for, his, his racing. But I think what he's gotten most famous for over the last couple years are his antics while running these races. he, to like to record himself during every single workout and run that he does and race. Ally: Mm-hmm. Mike: in trouble multiple times during many marathons for his brothers using e-bikes to record him while he's running a marathon with 20 to 50,000 people, which is very dangerous. Ally: So dangerous. Mike: and not acknowledging those, the issues that come up with that.

I mean, he, he got Ally: He got disqualified from, I think the Houston marathon for Houston. Um, Mike: he's Ally: he's been warned. I, Mike: it was Ally: it was Berlin. Mike: got Ally: I got worn in Chicago. Mike: then New Ally: Then New York City, uh, last year. Mike: a lot of Ally: A lot of people from Mike: him. I think Ally: Port Iowa, Mike: also reported him, I Ally: I don't remember, uh, about him Mike: e-bikes Ally: story, Mike: that Ally: that race and people pointed out that they got clipped by the E-bike. You not only put the runners at. Mike: it puts the, the spectators at risk as well.

he, he Ally: He has now banned from every single New York Roadrunner. Yeah. Mike: And Ally: And so, Mike: you know, Ally: you know, Mike: I say Ally: anti, Mike: I'm Ally: I'm really talking about someone who Mike: runs themselves. Like, I Ally: Like, I feel like Mike: the running influencers are running for other people so that they can get this, this, kind of gratitude and, and, what's the word? Ally: notoriety, Mike: Yeah, Ally: notoriety, Mike: from the Ally: the running, Mike: normal everyday Ally: everyday Mike: person who is not recording their runs, who is just going out there and, you know, maybe posting a picture, but like, they're just Ally: going out there.

Mike: sees, like the quiet work that they Ally: Mm-hmm. Mike: to get where they want to be. I always tell people I Ally: I don't work for myself. Mike: I Ally: I used to like, I used to a go with me, but Mike: I realized I never used it Ally: because Mike: I Ally: I would be so focused Mike: task at hand that I just, I, I didn't see a reason to record myself because I, I wanted Ally: Wanted focus on. Mike: more than just like getting good footage. Ally: Right, right. Mike: and I, Ally: And I wanna be the, Mike: the, like, I don't, I don't wanna like bash him, but like, I Ally: I found him, I found like several years Mike: and Ally: and I've always thought Mike: really pompous about what Ally: what Mike: with Ally: he does, Mike: running.

And, I Ally: I be Mike: kind of Ally: kind of Mike: person who is more of a, a down Ally: down, Mike: personable runner who Ally: who can really inspire those people that are Mike: getting Ally: getting started with their running or people who are, Mike: you know, not Ally: not those semis, Mike: not Ally: not those Mike: that Ally: that run. Mike: super fast. Ally: Obviously I've gotten faster over the years. Like, Mike: like I Ally: like I said, I still, Mike: I was running 12, 13 minute miles Ally: yeah. Mike: and so. I, Ally: I, I wanna be that. Mike: runner who is, who is inspirational to just, just average everyday people Ally: Yeah.

Mike: and, and Ally: And someone who doesn't go out there to try make for themselves Mike: and, really, putting Ally: putting on this persona that is Mike: is Ally: not Mike: genuine. Ally: I really Mike: don't Ally: don't like Mike: is it Ally: disingenuous Mike: ingenu? I don't, I think Ally: dis I think disingenuous is is the right word. Yeah. I really don't like this Mike: people. Ally: people. I can deeply Mike: point Ally: them out when I, when I hear it. When I see it. Mike: And Ally: And so when I, Mike: when I Ally: I post, Mike: footage, Ally: when I Mike: content, like it's like Ally: this, Mike: Like I Ally: I, Mike: my heart Ally: heartly Mike: Like this is what I do and this is how I Ally: how I talk, I, Mike: I act.

And I'm not Ally: I'm trying. Mike: up some sort of like mask of, of a character. And that's what I feel like a lot of these running influencers do and, and something that I feel like Matt Choi does. And Ally: So I wanna make sure that that runners know that, Mike: you know, whatever Ally: advice or support or Mike: or Ally: or care that they need Mike: from Ally: me as a, Mike: hate calling myself an influencer. 'cause the Ally: the only thing that I wanna, Mike: you to do is go out and Ally: right. I know it's really funny and even as small as I am, I've been called the same.

And why does it feel like it's a negative thing? 'cause it really shouldn't be. Like, you're just influencing people to do what's good for them themselves, you know? But Yeah, yeah, I understand that. and, and that's, that's really what I'm trying Mike: And Ally: so when I say Mike: match way, that's what I mean. Ally: yeah, yeah, I respect that a lot. I stopped following him. I mean, I was following him for a while, almost just like, 'cause I couldn't look away kind of a deal. but then I was like, okay, after New York last year, I was like, no, I'm not. I just am out.

I'm out. No thanks. Mike: I remember, I remember several years ago when I first met him, he was like running a marathon and he would just like yell into his GoPro like mile 1, 5 Ally: Oh my God. Mike: bro, you need to calm down. Like, Ally: man. Mike: you take, it is not that Ally: Yeah, Mike: unless you're at the Olympics or unless you're Connor Manz, like you, like, relax. Ally: Yeah. I don't know. Go for it, man. It's like, what? Whatever. But like just don't bring the E-bikes, like don't hurt people. Like that is where the line really needs to be drawn. It's like, do what you know?

Mike: the ego. Ally: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, man. Uh, okay, well it's time for the two end of the podcast questions that I ask everybody, and I'm really excited about the first one now that you have named your playlist running music and shit. That's great. So now the first question is your favorite running mantra and or song. So give us some songs from the playlist and then do you have a mantra that you use? I Mike: I Ally: do. Mike: actually, um, let me look at my phone ' cause I, there's a couple, I. So my running playlists are really, really weird. So I actually grew up listening to video game music.

Ally: Oh. Mike: and Ally: And so Mike: I Ally: I have several of those songs Mike: just like really bombastic, like orchestral, like in your face, Ally: that make feel like, Mike: a video game. Boss battle, that, that, that Ally: really come at me. Mike: you know, there, there's one called Find the Flame that I like. There's, a Ally: song Mike: the, what's it into the Spider verse. Ally: Oh, mm, Mike: which is, you know, where he jumps Ally: off Mike: That's a good one. run It, Ally: which is Mike: what's it, Sean Chi, the, Ally: Marvel. Mike: with SMU Lou, Ally: Oh, I'm bad.

I Mike: what, I forget what it's called, that one. what else do I have here? I have a couple Ally: Taylor Swift, Mike: Vigilant Anti shit, obviously, Ally: a good one. Yeah. Mike: that one makes me wanna fight Ally: Mm-hmm. Mike: Um, got a couple Chapel Road songs. know, the, what is it? Super graphic. Ultra Modern Girl is Ally: Like, Mike: a bop. So like, Ally: oh, I don't know that Mike: I Ally: I remember running down. Mike: Queensboro Bridge last year and I literally was just singing it out loud, like as it was coming on, and I Ally: Yeah. I was like, Mike: was dancing.

I was like, I don't care what anyone thinks right now. I'm just having a ball. and then Ally: red. Mike: Supernova is a Ally: Oh yeah. Mike: And what, what is it? Oh, ready For It by Taylor Swift. That, Ally: Okay. Mike: there. Mm. Ally: That's a good one. Mike: I just think about her, Aristo entrance for that. Ally: And Mike: feel invincible when I hear Ally: that's so funny. Yeah. And you have, do you have kids, right Mike? No, Mike: No, Ally: no, Mike: are actually in Ally: actually in Mike: of doing IVF. Ally: Okay. I was thinking, I saw, do you have nieces and nephews or any Like I've seen.

Okay. 'cause I've seen. Mike: I have one, I have one niece. I I do have one nephew, but my, my niece is like Ally: Okay. Mike: this, Ally: Ugh. Okay. So you're hoping to become a dad soon. I hope that that journey isn't too long. I have not gone through that, but I've known many people who have, and so Mike: yeah. It's been, uh, over I guess a year and a half Ally: Jesus, Ugh. I'm sorry. Well, when you have a daughter, she will appreciate that her dad loves Taylor Swift because, you know, um, Mike: my wife Ally: Kobe says Mike: that Ally: that Bernie Taylor Swift the best, Mike: She just doesn't know it yet, Ally: right?

Yeah. There you go. And then mantra, do you have any mantras that you like? Mike: so Ally: my favorite one actually, Mike: something that I learned from a therapist of mine, that has always stuck with me, which is through Ally: iComfort. Mike: comes progress. Ally: Mm-hmm. Mike: that has helped me in every facet of my life. Not just running, but you know, whether it's work, whether it's personal life, you know, everything that has always gotten me through, through everything that, if I'm a Ally: Run, Mike: or in a Ally: run a race and I'm in the locker. Like if I keep pushing, Mike: then, you know, eventually Ally: I'll, I'll Mike: come Ally: come out it.

Mike: no Ally: Mm-hmm. How, Mike: how Ally: how much pain I'm in. How much Mike: you know, Ally: exhaust? Mike: I have. If I keep pushing, this is what gets me through. Like the Brooklyn half last week, or the, the Bronx 10 Mile, or not Bronx 10 Mile. The um, broad Street is just like, yeah, it sucks Ally: Right now Mike: imagine the Ally: the finish line. Mike: Imagine being done, like you didn't come this far. Another one Ally: one is, Mike: you didn't come this far to only come Ally: yeah, I like that one too. Yeah. I feel like Peloton. They say that a lot.

Mike: Yes. Ally: is your, what is, is your Peloton leaderboard name? Mike runs marathons. Mike: No, Ally: that too long? Yeah. I was wondering what is your, okay. Mike: uh, we are resilient. Ally: Okay. we're gonna be friends because Yeah. Living in New York, you've, you've been to the studio, correct? Mike: I went once, Ally: I went once, yeah. Yeah. Mike: I run a Peloton group that has about 90,000 members. And Ally: Cool. Mike: yeah, it's called the Positive Peloton Group. I got invited to join this group of, what they're called, team captains, which is like this new feature that's in the app for you to create, a team for your whatever group that you Ally: Mm-hmm.

And Mike: when we, when Ally: when I went up Mike: April, they, we went up for the whole day. We did this whole thing on a Ally: a Everything Mike: some market research and then we did a 60 minute Ally: Ride, Mike: and Ally: that was my first time in the studio. And Mike: was, it was so cool. Not Ally: not only Mike: doing Ally: that, but Mike: to meet like a Ally: people, Mike: that, Ally: one people Mike: that I actually Ally: interview Mike: for the Ally: rundown, Mike: someone Ally: someone that I met Mike: there, and he Ally: He also ran Boston. Mike: it was just like such a, Ally: Totally Mike: mixture of Ally: extra world.

Mike: and so yeah, the, I Ally: I wanna go back up and do it again. Mike: I'm pretty sure, you know, they, they sell out very Ally: I know. I'm so lucky. I've gotten to go to the old studio, so I went, I forget which street it was on 22nd. I don't know. Mike: I Ally: think it was 20, Mike: Street, the Ally: 23rd. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it was awesome. I used to travel there for work and so I would pick my hotel based on proximity to the studio Mike: Mm-hmm. Ally: then get in. So I've gone a couple times there or a few times, but then I have not been to the new one.

So that's, I would love to do that at some point. Um, who is your favorite instructor or instructors? Mike: I Ally: I love Alec. Mike: um, because he is, he's really motivational, but sometimes you also need someone to just kick your ass. Ally: Yeah. To just scream at you. Mike: yeah, and I, I like Susie Chan because she's an ultra marathoner. Ally: She's the best. Mike: And then Mariana, I really like because she's like, she's super chill. Ally: Yeah, those are good ones. I love Susie Chan. Her book is incredible. If you haven't read it. Mike: Yes, Ally: loved her book. And I just think she's like, she's like, yeah, just keep running and that's how you do it.

And you're like, okay, Susie, that's what I'll do. okay. And then next finish line or milestone we've talked about already that you are gonna be running Chicago and New York this fall. and, and Philly. Okay. I missed that one. So will that be your first marathon outside of the majors? Mike: No, Ally: No, I did Mike: fill Ally: Philly in 2023. Okay. Mike: it was Ally: Oh, that's right. Mike: struggle. It was a big struggle. I got it. Band issues at like mile 18. So I'm, I'm hoping now with my, the new, the strength that I have now in my legs, and the, the training that I've done that I won't have that issue this time.

Ally: Yeah. Philly's the only marathon that I have, technically d nfd because I did it when they had the half and the full on the same day, and you could just like, peel off and finish the half. I was super sick 'cause I did Chicago that year, and I sh I had no business running even a half marathon that day. I was such an idiot, but I was very, I was just like, no, I'm stubborn. I'm, I'm here in Philly, I'm going to do this. I was with all my, you know, my girlfriends that were all running and so that was sad. I, I have a little bit of like, maybe I should do that, some dime as like redemption, like go back and run, run it.

But, I also need to figure out how to get you to come to Indianapolis because if you're chasing that sub three, like we are so flat and fast. So flat and fast. I mean, I forget, I should know the stat off the top of my head. I'm on our board of directors, but it's like the number of, Boston qualifiers or Olympic trial qualifiers for like a non net downhill course. Like that's, we have that, Mike: Wow. Ally: yeah, notification, notification, Jesus Christ, that notoriety. But we're a top 15 marathon in the country and we were hoping to break top 10 at some point. but yeah, if you've never been here, it's, it's, it's a really well done race.

Um, we've been doing it for over 15 years and obviously I'm a little biased 'cause I live here, but it's really flat, like, no, it's like Chicago, like no hills to speak of. And it's, it's amazing. So Mike: Send me the info. Ally: yeah, it's like right before New York though, every year. So that's the struggle is it's been on the same weekend before this year. It is, what is it? The 8th of November. Yeah, November 8th this year and New York is the following. No, the weekend before. So, you know, if you just wanna casually just run another marathon the week after, which is something you can do.

I can tell. So, well, thank you so much for doing this. It was a blast. And I told you that 90 minutes would just like fly by and they did. Mike: right. You were right. Ally: It's just wild to me every time I'm like, okay, and it's been 90 minutes, I don't know how, but it has, and it's just been such a pleasure getting a chance to actually sit down and talk to you versus just seeing your content pop up in my feed. So thanks for taking the time to do this and I appreciate what you're doing for the running community too, and, and sharing stories of, of other everyday runners.

Mike: I appreciate that and, Ally: I appreciate that. Mm-hmm. Mike: much for thinking of me with this. Ally: Yeah, absolutely. And thank you to everybody who listened and happy running. Hey, thanks so much for listening today. If you enjoyed this episode of Finish Lines and Milestones from Sandy Boy Productions, please share it with your friends. Give it a rating and review and share it with your friends. That's the best way for people to find this show, and I'm going off to spectate for the Run 3 1 7 West Clay, 3.17 mile race. So hopefully you saw saw me out there. I was cheering for you.

All right. Happy running. Bye.

Ally Brettnacher